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Students speak out on Harrison Butker's 'uncomfortable' commencement speech

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  perrie-halpern  •  4 weeks ago  •  262 comments

By:   Tim Stelloh and Minyvonne Burke

Students speak out on Harrison Butker's 'uncomfortable' commencement speech
Harrison Butker's commencement speech left some at Benedictine College outraged after the Kansas City Chiefs kicker encouraged women to become homemakers.

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


Harrison Butker's commencement speech last weekend left some graduates at Benedictine College outraged after the Kansas City Chiefs kicker asserted that one of the "most important" roles for a woman is being a homemaker and that Pride Month is an example of "deadly sin."

In the six days since the address, neither Butker, 28, nor the small Catholic school have commented publicly about the backlash — and graduates who attended the ceremony have been left to grapple with the fallout.

Kyra Misuraca, a 22-year-old graphic design major, said she was shocked that Butker used the speech to address gender roles instead of encouraging her and other graduating women to follow their dreams.

"My jaw dropped at one point," said another student, 21-year-old Susannah Leisegang, who also graduated with a graphic design degree. "It was just very uncomfortable, and I was looking back and forth at some of my friends and we were like, this is just not the time and place for this at all."

Mary Aaker, who graduated from Benedictine in 2019, said Butker's remarks were "disheartening."

"All of that was boiled down to, 'I bet you're most excited to go out and start a family,'" she said on NBC's "TODAY" show.

Butker used the speech to rail against President Joe Biden, abortion, IVF and the response to Covid-19. At one point, while criticizing a media report that mentioned the college, he said that students at the school felt "excitement and pride. Not the deadly sin sort of pride that has an entire month dedicated to it, but the true God-centered pride that is cooperating with the Holy Ghost to glorify him."

Roughly 12 minutes into the speech, Butker addressed the graduating women directly and said that "the most diabolical lies" had been told to them.

"How many of you are sitting here now, about to cross this stage, and are thinking about all the promotions and titles you are going to get in your career? Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world. But I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world."

Butker invoked his own success and attributed it to his wife, whom he said had converted to Catholicism, married him and "embraced one of the most important titles of all — homemaker," he said.

The line drew applause, but Misuraca said all the women sitting around her audibly gasped.

"I was very irritated that he would say that to a bunch of women who are graduating college with a degree in something that they're passionate about," she said.

But to another student in attendance, the outrage over the comment is misplaced. The student, who declined to be interviewed by phone but corresponded with NBC News via text and social media, said that he didn't believe Butker's comments should be interpreted as telling female students they should quit their jobs and become homemakers.

"Harrison said that women should appreciate the role of motherhood" more than they care about their jobs, he said.

"I don't agree with everything he said but it's also abundantly clear that everyone mad online didn't listen to the whole speech and are taking things out of context," he added. "I think the backlash is ridiculous; he was invited to speak at our small Catholic college where getting engaged/married right after college is a regular occurrence. He knew his audience and people on Instagram and X shouldn't be mad about something they weren't the target audience for."

Misuraca took issue with that description of the school. She said the college regularly recruits athletes — she attended on a basketball scholarship — who are non-Catholic or "barely" Catholic.

"Obviously, we come in knowing that it is a Catholic school and we are going to be around a lot of Catholic beliefs and we aren't Catholic, so we can't really say you're wrong, because that's what you believe," she said. "You can't really turn around and tell us what we believe."

The Sisters of Mount St. Scholastica, a founding institution and sponsor of the college, said Butker's comments do not "represent the Catholic, Benedictine, liberal arts college that our founders envisioned and in which we have been so invested."

"Instead of promoting unity in our church, our nation, and the world, his comments seem to have fostered division," an online statement reads.

At the end of Butker's speech, there was applause and many in the crowd rose to their feet.

But Misuraca said she remained seated and booed. Leisegang also booed. They both said they hoped that school administrators would eventually address graduates about the controversy.

Misuraca said an explanation would be appreciated, though she said ultimately it was Butker who delivered the speech, not a school official. Leisegang went further saying she wants an apology and that Butker's speech had overshadowed the day's importance.

"There were women walking across the stage with children in their hands, earning their degrees," she said. "And just to hear that — like, of course, his wife can become a homemaker. You're a millionaire. But that's not the reality for a lot of the country that we live in."


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jrDiscussion - desc
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Kavika
Professor Principal
1  Kavika     4 weeks ago

The nuns are not happy with Buckners commencement speech. If they have rulers Buckner is in big trouble.

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Quiet
1.1  Igknorantzruls  replied to  Kavika @1    4 weeks ago

my mother warned me about nuns with rulers

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.1.1  Split Personality  replied to  Igknorantzruls @1.1    4 weeks ago

I learned the hard way, but this kid called Big Ben learned about nuns and yardsticks

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.2  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.1    3 weeks ago

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.1.3  Split Personality  replied to  devangelical @1.1.2    3 weeks ago

One of my all time favorite stupid mall smashing, car smashing silliness tied to a great soundtrack.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.4  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.3    3 weeks ago

an unorthodox, but classic, car chase...

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.5  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.3    3 weeks ago

was it you that knew the movie trivia about the number of plymouths they wrecked during it's filming?

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.1.6  Split Personality  replied to  devangelical @1.1.5    3 weeks ago

There was a time when I knew it well !

LMAO!

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.7  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.6    3 weeks ago

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.2  Tessylo  replied to  Kavika @1    4 weeks ago

Sounds like Butker is a repressed and self loathing homosexual.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.2.1  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @1.2    4 weeks ago

[removed][.][]

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.2.2  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @1.2    4 weeks ago

with an aryan haircut...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.2.3  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @1.2.2    4 weeks ago

I saw a picture of the douchebag with Josh Hawley - wearing more hair product and make up than most women I know.

I think they're lovers

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.2.4  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @1.2.3    4 weeks ago

after this speech I'm sure he'll be meeting a lot of gay pro players when he's inducted into the 2024 NFL season's clothesline club...

 
 
 
goose is back
Sophomore Guide
1.2.5  goose is back  replied to  Tessylo @1.2    3 weeks ago
Sounds like Butker is a repressed and self loathing homosexual.

Do you deal with a lot of repressed self loathing homosexual's?

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.2.6  devangelical  replied to  goose is back @1.2.5    3 weeks ago

I think she ignores them...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.2.7  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @1.2.6    3 weeks ago

jrSmiley_93_smiley_image.jpg Yes, she does!

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.3  devangelical  replied to  Kavika @1    3 weeks ago

I think it's hilarious that this dumb ass football kicker basically put a "kick me" sign on his own back. moronic crusader...

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
2  Vic Eldred    4 weeks ago

“How many of you are sitting here now, about to cross this stage, and are thinking about all the promotions and titles you are going to get in your career? Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world. But I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world.”

Butker invoked his own success and attributed it to his wife, whom he said had converted to Catholicism, married him and “embraced one of the most important titles of all — homemaker,” he said.


Homemaker is right up there with all the other important titles and in many cases, women hold two of those titles.

Nothing at all unusual in a commencement speech at a private Catholic College.

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
2.1  Snuffy  replied to  Vic Eldred @2    4 weeks ago

I wonder how many people who are upset over this have taken the time to read the transcript of his speech. Doesn't seem nearly as bad as some are making it out to be.

Full Text: Harrison Butker of Kansas City Chiefs Graduation Speech| National Catholic Register (ncregister.com)

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
2.1.1  bugsy  replied to  Snuffy @2.1    4 weeks ago
Doesn't seem nearly as bad as some are making it out to be.

It is a religious man speaking at a private religious based school. For some, that is enough to hate him. Doesn't matter, really, what he said.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
2.1.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  bugsy @2.1.1    4 weeks ago
t is a religious man speaking at a private religious based school. For some, that is enough to hate him

Absolutely.  The other aspect to this that is quite ironic is that the people, press  and corporations who are so triggered by his speech are the ones  actually engaging in misogyny. . They apparently believe women who graduated college are so fragile, so weak minded that for them to even hear a speaker suggest that some women are made by happy by motherhood will traumatize them.   I think women are actually mentally strong enough to hear Butker talk   without it any way causing them trauma.  

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Junior Quiet
2.1.3  afrayedknot  replied to  Sean Treacy @2.1.2    4 weeks ago

“I think women are actually mentally strong enough to hear that without it any way causing them trauma. “

Of course they are.

That they are left to justify their standing in the face of lingering preaching by their brethren only gives them more strength and courage and support. 

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
3  Thomas    4 weeks ago
But I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world.

Yes, on the day that you graduate from college, the most important thing to you is how you are going to have children... /s

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
3.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Thomas @3    4 weeks ago
Yes, on the day that you graduate from college, the most important thing to you is how you are going to have children... /s

Not as important as knowing that the US is helping the Jew commit genocide in Gaza…/s

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Quiet
3.1.1  Igknorantzruls  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @3.1    4 weeks ago

whoa, did I miss something ...?

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
3.1.2  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Igknorantzruls @3.1.1    4 weeks ago

Campus commencement protests.

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Quiet
3.1.3  Igknorantzruls  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @3.1.2    4 weeks ago

i frown upon this, as protest peacefully away, but don't fck up what so many have strived to achieve and have accomplished and now deserve to celebrate

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
3.1.4  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Igknorantzruls @3.1.3    4 weeks ago

Agree.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
3.1.5  Thomas  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @3.1    4 weeks ago
Not as important as knowing that the US is helping the Jew commit genocide in Gaza…/s

This article is about other stuff, like parochial attitudes about women's roles in society. 

I was thinking the students would be concentrating on how excited they are to be graduating with a degree in something besides "homemaking" and "how to make your husband happy".

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1.6  Vic Eldred  replied to  Thomas @3.1.5    4 weeks ago
This article is about other stuff,

Oh yes, leftist outrage.

Even the woke NFL got involved. The same organization that happily allowed a player to wear "pig cop" socks now disassociates itself from another player who says he adores his wife, who chose to be a homemaker.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.1.7  Kavika   replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    4 weeks ago
Oh yes, leftist outrage.Even the woke NFL got involved. The same organization that happily allowed a player to wear "pig cop" socks now disassociates itself from another player who says he adores his wife, who chose to be a homemaker.

I'm sure that the Benedictine nuns are solid leftists, you should address them directly I'm sure that they would have a response for you. Perhaps they would use a ruler.

Benedictine College Nuns Condemn Harrison Butker’s Controversial Commencement Address

usmagazine

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.1.8  devangelical  replied to  Kavika @3.1.7    4 weeks ago

nuns are the backbone of the church. the majority of it's male clergy are troubled, useless, and hellbound...

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
3.1.9  Split Personality  replied to  Kavika @3.1.7    4 weeks ago

I would think that any mention of Biden or Trump a most inappropriate topic on graduation day as were abortion and IVF.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.1.10  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.9    4 weeks ago

you'd think a message of congratulations, optimism, and encouragement would be the norm...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.1.11  Tessylo  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    4 weeks ago

[removed][]

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
3.1.12  sandy-2021492  replied to  devangelical @3.1.10    4 weeks ago

You'd think.  But no, it had to be about his views on women, his loathing of LGBTQ people, his belief that you'll go to jail if you talk about who killed Jesus (that was veiled antisemitism.  Funny how some folks are so against it until they're for it.).  It had to be about Biden, abortion, family planning, and fertility care.

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
3.1.13  Snuffy  replied to  devangelical @3.1.8    4 weeks ago
the majority of it's male clergy are troubled, useless, and hellbound...

And his speech addressed that.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
3.1.14  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.9    4 weeks ago
I would think that any mention of Biden or Trump a most inappropriate topic on graduation day as were abortion and IVF.

Do you think that Biden giving the address at Morehouse a mistake?

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
3.1.15  Split Personality  replied to  Snuffy @3.1.13    4 weeks ago

Not the time or the place to discuss the Popes management issues...

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
3.1.16  Split Personality  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @3.1.14    4 weeks ago

No

and I would venture to guess that there won't be any blatant religious or political nonsense in Bidens speech,

probably a couple of lawyer jokes and exaggerated stories or gaffes

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
3.1.17  Snuffy  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.15    4 weeks ago

Did you read the speech or did you only see the snippets that were put into news articles? The way he talked was very much spot on and as this audience is basically comprised of new adults going out into the world for the first time, the way he talked about it was very spot on. He was more talking about the spiritual leaders of the church should be leaders rather than friends.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.1.18  devangelical  replied to  Snuffy @3.1.17    4 weeks ago
He was more talking about the spiritual leaders of the church should be leaders rather than friends.

whatever buries that failed mentality the deepest and the fastest...

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Junior Quiet
3.1.19  afrayedknot  replied to  Snuffy @3.1.17    4 weeks ago

“…new adults going out into the world for the first time…”

These are indeed young adults. Young adults that have negotiated the difficult times of middle school, high school and now college in times and circumstances that our generation never had to endure and cannot imagine. Give them credit for that, in spite of having to be subject to just another thing beyond their control.

Good luck to them all, at every graduation across the country…here’s hoping they overcome the mess we have left them, learn from our failures, and make this a better world.

I have faith that they will. 

 
 
 
Hallux
PhD Principal
3.1.20  Hallux  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    4 weeks ago
woke

Is a dead word on the left, this inane attempt to resuscitate it will only lead you down the rutted road of yore. MAGA is little more than rwnj wokeism on steroids.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
3.1.21  Split Personality  replied to  Snuffy @3.1.17    4 weeks ago

Harrison Butker | Commencement Address 2024 | Benedictine College (youtube.com)

Goebbels would be proud, delivered very sanely.

Possibly only one of the few actual  Catholics alive in the USA /S

The TLM?   Check to see who the Bishop is before you move somewhere?

The Church Priests and leadership are the problem just after declaring they were picked by God himself?

He thinks there a campaign to create single parent families and this is the down fall of American society and the source of crime?

I would be willing to bet he would die for the 2nd Amendment before he would die for any other reason.

I was waiting for him to say "I alone can solve the Problem".

Maybe after he retires from football and engineering...he can reform the church and start speaking Latin.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
3.1.22  Thomas  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    4 weeks ago
This article is about other stuff,

Oh yes, leftist outrage.

Even the woke NFL got involved. The same organization that happily allowed a player to wear "pig cop" socks now disassociates itself from another player who says he adores his wife, who chose to be a homemaker.

Presto, Change-oh, all of the sudden we are not talking about a person making a commencement address but the NFL and leftist outrage. Way to misdirect. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.1.23  Tessylo  replied to  Thomas @3.1.22    4 weeks ago

Excellent!  Truth

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.1.24  devangelical  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.1.12    4 weeks ago

pulpit bullies...

 
 
 
cjcold
Professor Quiet
3.1.25  cjcold  replied to  afrayedknot @3.1.19    4 weeks ago
our generation never had to endure

I can remember protests, bullhorns, riot gear and tear gas.

I'm sure the kids at Kent State had to endure some things as well.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
3.1.26  bugsy  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.6    4 weeks ago
The same organization that happily allowed a player to wear "pig cop" socks

Or allow sexual assault suspects and batterers continue to play

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1.27  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.16    4 weeks ago
and I would venture to guess that there won't be any blatant religious or political nonsense in Bidens speech,

But there will be a lot of antisemitism coming from students & teachers. I'll be tuned in tomorrow.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
3.1.28  sandy-2021492  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.27    4 weeks ago

Harrison let loose with some antisemitism.  I look forward to reading your condemnation of it.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
3.1.29  Thomas  replied to  Kavika @3.1.7    4 weeks ago

Just to be fair: Magnolia Tribune

Harrison Butker is Catholic. Invited to give a commencement address at Benedictine College, Butker espoused views commonly associated with Catholic doctrine. At the conclusion of his remarks, the Kansas City Chiefs’ kicker received a standing ovation from those in attendance.

He was invited by the President of Benedictine College and it's board. I have not seen any statements from them that indicate that they were not copesetic with his remarks. That said, standing ovations ain't what they used to be. Standing ovations seem to be given for any performance regardless of the quality. Also, the Benedictine College has a Graduation 2024 page on their website and they have video directly posted for several parts of the ceremony, but the Commencement speech links to an article about the speech , which has a link in it to take one to the speech, but largely avoids the more (eh-hem) preachy themes of his address. 

I think that the leaders of the college are aware of the prevalent attitudes of the country and the acceptance of certain non-doctrinal attitudes held by many practicing Catholics, and, in an attempt to not alienate potential students, have made this decision to put the remarks a bit further away from the front page, so to speak. 

Bugers

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
3.1.30  Split Personality  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.27    4 weeks ago
But there will be a lot of antisemitism coming from students & teachers.

Antisemitism is a hatred of Jews in general,

Anti Israeli government policies aren't a hatred of Jews, they are a hatred of what Netanyahu and his government are doing, which is reminiscent of what Hitler did to the Jews in the slums of Warsaw.

Oh, the irony.

I'll be tuned in tomorrow.

oK

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.1.31  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.1.12    4 weeks ago

Yeah, I'm not good with that. Does he hang out with Mel?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1.32  Vic Eldred  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.30    4 weeks ago
Antisemitism is a hatred of Jews in general,

It is no longer in general. It is being taught on campus by leftist professors.


Anti Israeli government policies aren't a hatred of Jews,

Reciting "from the river to the sea" and "death to Jews" has put that excuse to rest.


Oh, the irony.

The irony is that Biden is counting on such people to vote for him.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
3.1.33  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.30    4 weeks ago
Anti Israeli government policies aren't a hatred of Jews, they are a hatred of what Netanyahu and his government are doing, which is reminiscent of what Hitler did to the Jews in the slums of Warsaw.

Exactly, that’s why students are also demonstrating against the human rights abuses in other countries receiving US aid like Ethiopia, Egypt, Sudan, Somali, Yemen, etc.  

The non-Israeli Jew remains popular on campus.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.1.34  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @3.1.33    4 weeks ago

I have to agree with you!

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.1.35  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @3.1.21    3 weeks ago
reform the church and start speaking Latin

a dead language in a dying religion...

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.2  devangelical  replied to  Thomas @3    4 weeks ago

why is some brain washed mackerel snapping clown that kicks a football for a vocation denigrating women that have graduated college to pursue their professional dreams? when will religious relics figure out that to save their rapidly diminishing numbers and popularity among america that maybe the church is the one that should be adapting to modern culture with a modern message.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.2.1  devangelical  replied to  devangelical @3.2    4 weeks ago

meh, on second thought, he probably bribed some collared celibate jerkoff for the privilege to speak there ...

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
3.2.2  bugsy  replied to  devangelical @3.2    4 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.3  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @3.2.1    4 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.2.4  devangelical  replied to  bugsy @3.2.2    4 weeks ago

please quote that part of my comment.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.2.5  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @3.2.3    4 weeks ago
Josh Hawley

fist in the air in support of insurrectionists on his way into the capitol, and sprinting out with his fascist tail between his legs later, knowing full well that trump's legion of maga morons would be too blinded by ignorant partisan rage to spare his worthless life...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.6  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @3.2.5    4 weeks ago

What a dickless coward!

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.2.7  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @3.2.6    3 weeks ago

meh, I like when rwnj's put out the karma welcome mat ...

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
4  Sean Treacy    4 weeks ago

“I don’t see what the big crime is.” “I really don’t. And I think this is part of the problem people have with the left is that lots of people in this country are like this. Like he’s saying, some of you may go on to lead successful careers, but a lot of you are excited about this other way that people, everybody used to be. And now, can’t that just be a choice, too?”

Noted right wing social warrior bill maher,

 
 
 
Robert in Ohio
Professor Guide
5  Robert in Ohio    4 weeks ago

A lot of people are outraged - imagine that in this day and age jrSmiley_7_smiley_image.png

He spoke to a graduating class at a church-oriented institution.

He spoke of "his" view on life and none of the graduates (or the outraged members of social media) are bound to follow the path he outlined

I imagine that within the ranks of the female graduates there are more than a few that will go on to do great things for society and maybe a few that will decide to become stay at home moms.  And I say hats off to them all, because it is their choice and no one's business but the graduates.

People say things that we agree with and motivate us (and that is good), while others say things that shock and maybe outrage us (that is also good) so long as both are used to motivate our actions, help mold our decisions and help us achieve things in life.

If someone says something that angers you, that shocks you or surprises you and all that you get from it is outrage then you are losing out.

I am so tired of "the public being outraged" on social media by this or that - since the outrage only lasts until something new comes along to be outraged about.

Just one man's opinion

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Senior Guide
5.1  Right Down the Center  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5    4 weeks ago

Perfectly said

I feel sorry for the people that spend all day every day looking for something to be outraged over in their search for likes or views.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
5.2  Kavika   replied to  Robert in Ohio @5    4 weeks ago

Tell that to the nuns.

Benedictine College Nuns Condemn Harrison Butker’s Controversial Commencement Address

 
 
 
Robert in Ohio
Professor Guide
5.2.1  Robert in Ohio  replied to  Kavika @5.2    4 weeks ago

The outrage of the "nuns" is no more important than the outrage of a fast food worker, or a data scientist, or the lack of outrage by the majority of people who understand that the speech was "one man's opinion" and not something on stone tablets carried down a mountain.

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Quiet
5.2.2  Igknorantzruls  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5.2.1    4 weeks ago
"one man's opinion" and not something on stone tablets carried down a mountain.

Holy Moses, do I see a blizzard in the forecast...?

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Quiet
5.2.3  Igknorantzruls  replied to  Igknorantzruls @5.2.2    4 weeks ago

headed to DQ

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
5.2.4  Kavika   replied to  Robert in Ohio @5.2.1    4 weeks ago
The outrage of the "nuns" is no more important than the outrage of a fast food worker, or a data scientist, or the lack of outrage by the majority of people who understand that the speech was "one man's opinion" and not something on stone tablets carried down a mountain.

Nonsense, none of those named work, attend, live or represent the school. The nuns may have a direct vote as to who is invited to speak at the school..That makes their voice much more important than the bozo's off the street.

Do you have some stats that the majority saw it as one man's opinion?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
5.2.5  Tessylo  replied to  Igknorantzruls @5.2.3    4 weeks ago

jrSmiley_91_smiley_image.gif would you pick me up a chili dog while you're there?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
5.2.6  Tessylo  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5.2.1    4 weeks ago

What the huh?  Their opinion means nothing???????????????

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.2.7  Trout Giggles  replied to  Kavika @5.2    3 weeks ago

Modern Catholics are just that...modern. Not all women want to wives and mothers. Even the RCC doesn't go out of its way to insist that women stay at home and nurse babies. Most of the lay people that you see at Mass are mostly women. They were at my church.

So he's a little old-fashioned and he got an old-fashioned girl to marry him. I hope he ends up with 5 daughters who all spit at the notion of only being wives and mothers

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
5.2.8  Vic Eldred  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.7    3 weeks ago
Not all women want to wives and mothers.

And nobody ever said they should only be that. There is nothing wrong with that speech.

This is why people can't stand the woke crazies.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.2.9  Trout Giggles  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.2.8    3 weeks ago

You don't know anything about "woke". Do you really think a woman should spend all that money for an education only to just get married and raise children?

Don't bother answering

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
5.2.10  Vic Eldred  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.9    3 weeks ago
Don't bother answering

Agreed!

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
5.2.11  Sparty On  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.2.10    3 weeks ago

God forbid one speaks off liberal narrative ….must attack, marginalize and gaslight …

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
5.2.12  Sean Treacy  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.9    3 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
5.2.13  Sean Treacy  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.2.8    3 weeks ago
d nobody ever said they should only be that.

It's crazy how they made up a speech and attacked it.  

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
5.2.14  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.9    3 weeks ago
Do you really think a woman should spend all that money for an education only to just get married and raise children?

Are you upset that there are some that would CHOOSE that?  

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
5.2.15  devangelical  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.2.8    3 weeks ago
the woke crazies

stick up their ass conservatives have been saying that since before 1776...

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
5.2.16  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sparty On @5.2.11    3 weeks ago

You know it cracks me up, that a pile of men are determining what a woman wants out of her life. That is the issue here. That should be a non-partisan issue, but sadly these days, everything is.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.2.17  Trout Giggles  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @5.2.16    3 weeks ago

I'm gonna get a beating for this but it's misogyny on vicious display here. They never asked us what we wanted just told us what we wanted

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
5.2.18  JBB  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.17    3 weeks ago

Oh hush up, and go make me a sandwich! /s...

My Mama say, "Yes, most of the men in my life were chauvinist pigs, but they were my pigs. It is all those other pigs that bother me"...

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.2.19  Trout Giggles  replied to  JBB @5.2.18    3 weeks ago
Oh hush up, and go make me a sandwich! /s...

Go make your own sandwich and when you come back bring me a beer!

My dad didn't really believe in gender specific roles for his daughter. I got to mow grass, feed pigs, calves, and do chores around the farm. But I also got to do things my brother didn't like help mom around the house and help in the kitchen

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
5.2.20  devangelical  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @5.2.16    3 weeks ago

don't forget they've got a book that says women are one rung above farm animals in social stature and intelligence...

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.2.21  Trout Giggles  replied to  devangelical @5.2.20    3 weeks ago

snort

lower intelligence, eh?

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
5.2.22  JBB  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.19    3 weeks ago

Us boys ran the vacuum and loaded the dishwasher much to my Grandfather's disapproval, butt he grew up with sisters...

I fed cattle before and after school every day. There was no end to "Boy's Work" on a big farming and ranching operation. Till I was 60!

That is when I retired and became a Yankee. Praise The Lord...

Butt, when it came to laundry, I played dumb till I was in college!

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
5.2.23  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @5.2.16    3 weeks ago
, that a pile of men are determining what a woman wants out of her life.

Exactly. A man has no place telling a women there are many viable paths to fulfilling life. He must tell her that if she doesn't climb the corporate ladder and earn promotions and massive amounts of income she's a failure. It's was incredibly insensitive of Butker to say homemaker is also an important title.

That is the issue here.

Really? I thought it was making up the contents of a speech to attack, [] and then insult and censor anyone who doesn't agree while criticizing women who go college and choose to be homemakers.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
5.2.28  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @5.2.23    3 weeks ago

The rest of the comments in this thread were removed for no value.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
5.2.29  devangelical  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @5.2.28    3 weeks ago

oh man ...

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Junior Quiet
5.3  afrayedknot  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5    4 weeks ago

Hopefully we’ll all look back on these comments and apply the same level of tolerance to every commencement speech…even the one at Moorhead. 

 
 
 
afrayedknot
Junior Quiet
5.3.1  afrayedknot  replied to  afrayedknot @5.3    3 weeks ago

Another forlorn hope it seems. 

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
5.3.2  Split Personality  replied to  afrayedknot @5.3.1    3 weeks ago

Yep.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
5.4  Tessylo  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5    4 weeks ago

'Just one man's opinion'

regarding women

and how they choose to live their lives 

jrSmiley_80_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
5.5  Thomas  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5    4 weeks ago

Who is outraged?

If strong language such as "outraged" or "slammed" et al  is used in a headline, chances are that it is propaganda.  Social media must get more clicks if somebody is outraged. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
5.6  Tessylo  replied to  Robert in Ohio @5    4 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
6  sandy-2021492    4 weeks ago

In a discussion elsewhere, some guy who reflexively posts in agreement every time something misogynistic comes up of course posted that he agrees with Butker.

He disappeared when it was pointed out that his own children were conceived only with medical assistance from a fertility clinic.

Butker also made quite a few homophobic statements, and there was a bit of veiled antisemitism in there, too.

But hey, it's just his opinion, right?  He used a platform traditionally used for congratulating young people on their accomplishments and encouraging them to embrace their future challenges, and instead made it about politics and how much he doesn't like some people.  No big deal.

 
 
 
Robert in Ohio
Professor Guide
6.1  Robert in Ohio  replied to  sandy-2021492 @6    4 weeks ago

But hey, it's just his opinion, right?  He used a platform 

Sounds like every what happens everytime a politician or political activist opens their mouth these days - they use the platform (regardless of the setting) to present their points of view and their messgae.

But it is their opinion no big deal right?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
6.1.1  Tessylo  replied to  Robert in Ohio @6.1    4 weeks ago

No big deal to you, a 'man'

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
6.2  devangelical  replied to  sandy-2021492 @6    3 weeks ago

hatred, misogyny, and intolerance all wrapped up nicely with a non-secular bow...

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
6.2.1  Sparty On  replied to  devangelical @6.2    3 weeks ago

Remove the “non” and then you’re spot on.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
7  sandy-2021492    4 weeks ago

256

 
 
 
Robert in Ohio
Professor Guide
7.1  Robert in Ohio  replied to  sandy-2021492 @7    4 weeks ago

News flash

Bears don't talk

A little humor in a serious situation

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.1.1  Tessylo  replied to  Robert in Ohio @7.1    4 weeks ago

It's not funny

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Quiet
7.2  Igknorantzruls  replied to  sandy-2021492 @7    4 weeks ago

Possibly in a grizzly attempt to poke fun at the Bi's, polar opposite of the color spectrum, the blacks bare too much and panda to the social elitists' in a tempts to garner a kodiak moment, while the browns just hunt the deer student college bodies for the sweet honies, lookin to bee their Sugar bears to sun their bare bottoms which one needs not be a sloth with spectacles to see, asz bare bear bottoms prefer the ultra soft unorthodox flying nuns that fly through silly sally fields looking for a wrap of Reynolds, only to be caught by Smokey The bear, and his abandoned bandit, asz the nunz get hot asz hell as they search for those bi-polar ones

asz they eat penguins...

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
7.3  Snuffy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @7    4 weeks ago

And to be fair, Butker didn't say that. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
7.3.1  sandy-2021492  replied to  Snuffy @7.3    4 weeks ago

Verbatim?

No.

Those are the implications of his words, though.  The praise for his wife (who's married to a millionaire, lucky her) giving up her career dreams.  The accusation that women have been lied to about working outside the home.  The rushing right past the women's accomplishments to the "but babies" part.  The "my wife's life didn't begin until she married and had kids" part.

Please don't expect us to buy into spin that he's encouraging women to have careers and be mothers, because he's just not.

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
7.3.2  Snuffy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @7.3.1    4 weeks ago

Different people can have different interpretations based on their life experiences and biases. When there's someone I really don't know, I try not to read into their words. And in the great scheme of things, this is nothing to burn the world down over. Every day someone is saying something that someone else is going to be offended over. When compared to all the other issues around the world, this seems to be very small.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
7.3.3  sandy-2021492  replied to  Snuffy @7.3.2    4 weeks ago

Sure, Snuffy.  We all know what he meant.

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
7.3.4  Snuffy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @7.3.3    4 weeks ago

You have your interpretation, please don't speak for everyone.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
7.3.5  sandy-2021492  replied to  Snuffy @7.3.4    4 weeks ago

You can spin if you like.  I am not obligated to accept the spin, or let it stand unchallenged.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.3.6  Tessylo  replied to  Snuffy @7.3.4    4 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
Snuffy
Professor Participates
7.3.7  Snuffy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @7.3.5    4 weeks ago

Just as you can spin as you like and I'm not obligated to accept your spin or let it stand unchallenged.

But when you use the words :

Sure, Snuffy.  We all know what he meant.

you imply you are speaking for everyone rather than yourself. I was very careful in 7.3.2 to show I was speaking for myself only. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.3.8  Tessylo  replied to  Snuffy @7.3.7    4 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
7.3.9  Trout Giggles  replied to  Snuffy @7.3.7    3 weeks ago

Add one voice to Sandy's

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
7.3.10  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @7.3.9    3 weeks ago

2...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.3.11  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @7.3.10    3 weeks ago

3

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
8  charger 383    4 weeks ago

I wonder about Graduation speeches, If the school hasn't taught you in all the classes how is some speech going to help?    

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
8.1  Sparty On  replied to  charger 383 @8    4 weeks ago

Bazinga.     The commencement is just tradition.    More or less meaningless imo.

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
8.1.1  charger 383  replied to  Sparty On @8.1    4 weeks ago

I graduated in December and did not go to that ceremony or want to wait for May. I just wanted the Diploma. They charged me $50 non attendance fee.  I did not want to set through and listen to one more thing.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
8.1.2  Sparty On  replied to  charger 383 @8.1.1    4 weeks ago

I hear ya.    I was only there because it meant something to other family and friends.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
8.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  charger 383 @8    3 weeks ago

It's to draw out the ceremonies. People just want to get their diplomas and get the party

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
8.2.1  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @8.2    3 weeks ago

precisely. my 600+ student graduation was an exercise in alphabetical mass production. eat a gram of hash, do a couple shots of tequila, go inside the auditorium to throw on the cap and gown, get handed a blank piece of paper rolled up with a ribbon, trip on my gown going down the stairs from the stage, hand over the cap and gown to the front of the line, pocket the tassel, trade the blank piece of paper for my diploma, head out to the parking lot to wait for my friends, and blackout at a party for 2 days...

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
8.2.2  devangelical  replied to  devangelical @8.2.1    3 weeks ago

... get teased about some of the shit I did that weekend for a few years. good times ...

 
 
 
Robert in Ohio
Professor Guide
9  Robert in Ohio    4 weeks ago

A graduation speaker's presentation is designed to give the students a look at the speaker's view of the world, not to dictate the graduates' view.  The graduates should take what is said in balance with their own beliefs and goals and weigh its value.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
9.1  Tessylo  replied to  Robert in Ohio @9    4 weeks ago

Not the time or place for his ignorant views and opinions.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
9.1.1  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @9.1    4 weeks ago

why would anyone that had to work for anything they ever wanted want to listen to some jerk that had everything in life and a degree handed to him because he could kick a football. this country's attitude towards merit and value is backwards.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
9.2  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Robert in Ohio @9    4 weeks ago
A graduation speaker's presentation is designed to give the students a look at the speaker's view of the world, not to dictate the graduates' view.  The graduates should take what is said in balance with their own beliefs and goals and weigh its value.

I'm going to disagree with you, Robert. The purpose of the speech is to inspire. Telling girls that they have just wasted their time, is does the complete opposite.

And for the record, I was pretty disgusted with our keynote speaker, Spike Lee, and wrote about it here. Schools really should vet these speeches.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
9.2.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @9.2    4 weeks ago
he purpose of the speech is to inspire.

That's clearly what he was doing.  

Telling girls that they have just wasted their time, is does the complete opposite.

good thing he  didn't say that!

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
9.2.2  TᵢG  replied to  Sean Treacy @9.2.1    4 weeks ago
good thing he  didn't say that!

He said this:

"How many of you are sitting here now, about to cross this stage, and are thinking about all the promotions and titles you are going to get in your career? Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world. But I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world."

Butker invoked his own success and attributed it to his wife, whom he said had converted to Catholicism, married him and "embraced one of the most important titles of all — homemaker," he said.

The line drew applause, but Misuraca said all the women sitting around her audibly gasped.

"I was very irritated that he would say that to a bunch of women who are graduating college with a degree in something that they're passionate about," she said.

Which is basically that he believes most of the women who are graduating with an advanced degree really are going to end up being homemakers anyway rather than truly pursue the career based on their formal education.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
9.2.3  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @9.2.1    4 weeks ago
That's clearly what he was doing.  

Says who? You a guy?

I don't find this inspirational:

Roughly 12 minutes into the speech, Butker addressed the graduating women directly and said that “the most diabolical lies” had been told to them.  “How many of you are sitting here now, about to cross this stage, and are thinking about all the promotions and titles you are going to get in your career? Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world. But I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world.”

I didn't know that women attend college to get their M.R.S. I thought they went to get an education.

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
9.2.4  bugsy  replied to  TᵢG @9.2.2    4 weeks ago

[]

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
9.2.5  Tessylo  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @9.2.3    4 weeks ago

That's what I would have gone to college for - to hear at my commencement some entitled prick telling me/preaching to me - his entitled douchebag message.

Fuck him

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
9.2.6  devangelical  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @9.2.3    3 weeks ago

it's the maga version of thumper lebensborn...

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
10  Sparty On    4 weeks ago

Meh, my commencement speaker was Admiral Zumwalt.     He talked Nuclear Proliferation.    I was only there because my parents wanted it.

He could have been whistling zippity do da day out his bung hole …. I could have cared less.

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
12  Greg Jones    4 weeks ago

A Christian man expressing his views to probably mostly Chrisitan students in a Christian school graduation...oh the horror! If a Muslim man expressed similar views, he probably would be praised. To have this story rise to the level of national outrage is absurd and shows how far as a rational society we have fallen.

Historically and culturally in the past, society worldwide has fared better when children have a mother and a father. This is not always possible in today's world. Single parent and mixed families are commonplace. I fully support women doing and being all that they can be, but I think the point that Butker was making is that women shouldn't be ashamed if they aspire to be mothers and homemakers. 

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
12.1  Split Personality  replied to  Greg Jones @12    4 weeks ago
To have this story rise to the level of national outrage is absurd and shows how far as a rational society we have fallen.

No, it's just a symptom of people who live on social media and think their 2 cents worth of opinion is important.

but I think the point that Butker was making is that women shouldn't be ashamed if they aspire to be mothers and homemakers. 

and although it's none of his business, statistically that would probably happen but Butker isn't the Pope and bitching about Biden or Trump was totally off topic.

just my 2 cents

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
12.1.1  Greg Jones  replied to  Split Personality @12.1    4 weeks ago

So what should his topic have been? And why are the leftists among us so upset about one person's freedom of speech? 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
12.1.2  Gsquared  replied to  Greg Jones @12.1.1    4 weeks ago

That comment is a complete distortion.  He can say what he wants, no matter how benighted, and his critics are free to criticize him.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
12.1.3  devangelical  replied to  Gsquared @12.1.2    3 weeks ago

apparently free speech ends when conservative xtians stop talking ...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
12.1.4  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @12.1.3    3 weeks ago

Like with Colin Kaepernick?

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
12.1.5  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @12.1.4    3 weeks ago

that usually happens to those that speak truth to power...

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
12.1.6  Split Personality  replied to  devangelical @12.1.5    3 weeks ago

Now he is comparing himself to the Saints of the Catholic Church, his bravery and his calling from God....

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
12.1.7  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @12.1.6    3 weeks ago
his bravery and his calling from God

gee, do you think that's a good idea, you know, while wearing light padding and having 300 lb athletes, that might not agree with your religious dogma, running towards you as fast as they can? it seems his god has a sense of humor.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
12.1.8  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @12.1.6    3 weeks ago

is it pretty hilarious when the self righteous do their inevitable face plants though...

give me some time and I'll work up the odds on his statistical probabilities, but I'm already leaning hard towards him being closeted, after learning he has a clothing line...

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
12.2  bugsy  replied to  Greg Jones @12    4 weeks ago
If a Muslim man expressed similar views, he probably would be praised.

Case in point you have Hamas supporting graduates celebrating Hamas supporting speakers at this year's college commencements.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
12.2.1  seeder  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  bugsy @12.2    4 weeks ago

And I think that is also inappropriate.

 
 
 
Dragon
Freshman Silent
13  Dragon    4 weeks ago

I didn't go to my undergraduate or graduate graduation ceremony back in the 70s. I had put myself through college as my parents could not afford to help me. I had done the work, put in the time and just wanted to be on my way. 

I never had any desire to be married or have children, I wanted a career, to travel, to be independent. I did all that, was very content. Met my husband at 38 when I went to Cancun by myself on a scuba diving tour. Husband did not want children either. We both had successful careers, retired early, financially well off, continue to volunteer, travel, raise fur babies.  

I have friends of all genders, faiths, demographics, some glad they had children, some not. Some glad they didn't have children, some not. Some glad they stayed home to raise a family, some not. It takes all kinds to make this world go around. 

As far as the speech, I don't have issues with it, but hopefully the graduates are intelligent enough, have common sense enough to see it is one person's opinion and they make their own decisions about their lives. 

BTW I was raised in a very Christian house and community, life usually revolved around church activities. Never once was being a homemaker, mother/father, having children empathized. Following biblical teachings, being grounded in faith was prioritized but never was anyone denounced for their lifestyle or choices in life. 

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
13.1  devangelical  replied to  Dragon @13    4 weeks ago

I never wanted kids, but I married a catholic, so now I have 3 adult children that I couldn't be more proud of and can't imagine what my life would be like without them.

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
13.2  Greg Jones  replied to  Dragon @13    4 weeks ago

Well spoken, common sense is sometimes forgotten in the heat of the moment by some.

Bill Maher defends Harrison Butker amid speech uproar: 'I don't see what the big crime is' (msn.com)

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
13.2.1  Tessylo  replied to  Greg Jones @13.2    4 weeks ago

Screw Bill Maher.  I never really liked him.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
15  Gsquared    4 weeks ago

How about if Butker gets a real job and contributes something useful to society.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
15.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

He’s brought joy to millions and has paid millions in taxes at the age of 28. 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
15.1.1  Gsquared  replied to  Sean Treacy @15.1    4 weeks ago
He’s brought joy to millions

A mere platitude.  

has paid millions in taxes

How do you know how much in taxes he's paid?  Show us his tax records.  

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
15.1.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  Gsquared @15.1.1    4 weeks ago

[]

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.1.3  Tessylo  replied to  Sean Treacy @15.1    4 weeks ago

Joy?  By being a football player?  What does he contribute to society?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.1.4  Tessylo  replied to  Tessylo @15.1.3    4 weeks ago

Such wonderful priorities.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.1.5  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @15.1.3    4 weeks ago

to be fair, I do enjoy watching those wimpy NFL kickers getting run over by the defense...

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
15.1.6  Thomas  replied to  Tessylo @15.1.3    4 weeks ago
What does he contribute to society?

Money.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.1.7  Tessylo  replied to  Thomas @15.1.6    4 weeks ago

That's all

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
15.2  Sparty On  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

[]

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
15.2.2  Sparty On  replied to  Sparty On @15.2    4 weeks ago

[deleted and referred to the RA][]

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
15.3  charger 383  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

He is one of the best at his position and when he retires, he will not have work again

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
15.3.1  Gsquared  replied to  charger 383 @15.3    4 weeks ago

Irrelevant.

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
15.3.2  charger 383  replied to  Gsquared @15.3.1    4 weeks ago

Do people with regular jobs usually get asked to be commencement speakers?

Like what he said or not, he is very successful 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.3.3  Tessylo  replied to  charger 383 @15.3    4 weeks ago

So what?

Misplaced priorities.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.3.4  Tessylo  replied to  charger 383 @15.3.2    4 weeks ago

So fucking what.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
15.3.5  Split Personality  replied to  charger 383 @15.3.2    4 weeks ago
Do people with regular jobs usually get asked to be commencement speakers?

No, they are usually senior military leaders or politicians, past and present who know how to deliver a

commencement speech to Ba,BS,MD,MS and PHD graduates without insulting the graduates personal beliefs.

Like what he said or not, he is very successful 

Successful financially.  Is that the only measure of success?  

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.3.6  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @15.3.5    4 weeks ago
Successful financially. Is that the only measure of success? 

it is for some, no matter how they came by it...

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
15.3.7  Sean Treacy  replied to  Split Personality @15.3.5    4 weeks ago
Successful financially.  Is that the only measure of success?  

Lol. He's at the very top off his profession, has won awards, holds records, has a family and is a philanthropist, and earned tens of millions of dollars  because of his elite skills.  

As his handling of hostile crowds demonstrates, he can even handle criticism without acting out and engaging in petty relation towards his critics. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.3.8  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.3.6    4 weeks ago

I think this 'guy' is jealous of all the attention Travis Kelce and Taylor Swift have been getting

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.3.9  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @15.3.8    4 weeks ago

of course, they're living in sin ...

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
15.3.10  Split Personality  replied to  Sean Treacy @15.3.7    3 weeks ago
He's at the very top off his profession, has won awards, holds records, has a family and is a philanthropist,   

I see no evidence of the kicker being a philanthropist, have you any links?

and earned tens of millions of dollars  because of his elite skills.

I have no issue with that although I know a few professional kickers and they attribute their success to having a particular goal early on, and working tirelessly toward that goal throughout their lives practicing every day, and not generally crediting Jesus for their success.

As his handling of hostile crowds demonstrates,

What hostile crowds has he faced? Football games? Soccer games?  Anonymous critics on the internet for the last week?

he can even handle criticism without acting out and engaging in petty relation towards his critics. 

Relation?

Now he is comparing himself to the Catholic Churches Saints, Daniel being eaten by lions, and his personal calling from God.  

The more he talks, the more I feel sorry for him, but he has every right to be all he wants to be including  more than a hint of being antisemitic.

In his commencement address, Butker said, “Congress just passed a bill where stating something as basic as the biblical teaching of who killed Jesus could land you in jail.” The Antisemitic Innuendo in Harrison Butker’s College Commencement Speech (thedailybeast.com)

Butker lied several times in one sentence. Typical anti semitic inuendo from a Christian extremist.  The House passed an educational bill called the Antisemitism Awareness Act which wasn't passed by the Senate and isn't a law and had no criminal penalties in it.  According to the bible, the Romans crucified Jesus.

I wonder what Butker's opinions about Gaza and Israel are.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
15.3.11  Sean Treacy  replied to  Split Personality @15.3.10    3 weeks ago
ee no evidence of the kicker being a philanthropist

He has his own charitable foundation.

ticing every day, and not generally crediting Jesus for their success

Who could possibly care about that?

What hostile crowds has he faced? Football games? Soccer games? Anonymous critics on the internet for the last week?

Yes

more I feel sorry for him

[deleted]

[] wonder what Butker's opinions about Gaza and Israel are.

Who cares? Why does a kicker who gave a speech at a small private college demand so much attention from progressives? If one only paid attention to progressive schoolmarms, the only things that matter in this country are a graduation speech and a flag as they pinball between attacking Alito for not controlling his woman and then attacking Butker for suggesting women have choices in their life.

Typical anti semitic inuendo from a Christian extremist

[deleted][]

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.4  devangelical  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

I'll never understand the elevation of somebody with physical prowess as a template for leadership or social significance in our culture. very rarely do those attributes combine in a positive way.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.4.1  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.4    4 weeks ago

So true.  They're seen as heroes to some.  

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.4.2  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @15.4.1    4 weeks ago

I cut my teeth on fucking over arrogant jockstraps in high school on my way to the total humiliation of rwnj's today. at our 50th reunion of a graduating class of 600+, nobody organized it or showed up for it. I'm used to the division between the entitled and self righteous perpetuating the fraud of the status quo versus the normal and sane that think they should just stfu and go away. the late 60's and early 70's opened my eyes to those living in a fantasy land of hypocrisy that doesn't exist for those they consider outsiders. F them.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.4.3  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.4.2    4 weeks ago

Bunch of dumb jocks.  I agree,  Fuck 'em

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
15.5  Greg Jones  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

He's got a real job. He contributes a lot to his team and very likely much to his community.  Why all the hate and lack of tolerance toward a religious person?

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
15.5.1  sandy-2021492  replied to  Greg Jones @15.5    4 weeks ago
lack of tolerance

Where is his tolerance for LGBTQ people?

For people who conceive via IVF?

For those who use birth control to avoid having children they can't afford?

For those who cohabitate with their girlfriends or boyfriends?

For those who leave the church?

As ye sow, so shall ye also reap.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.2  Tessylo  replied to  sandy-2021492 @15.5.1    4 weeks ago

I can't stand these phonier than thou small c christians

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.5.3  devangelical  replied to  sandy-2021492 @15.5.1    4 weeks ago

I'm sure he saved himself for the right xtian girl, all the way thru high school and college...

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
15.5.4  bugsy  replied to  Greg Jones @15.5    4 weeks ago
religious person

There is your answer to leftist hate.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.5  Tessylo  replied to  Greg Jones @15.5    4 weeks ago

How is that even considered a real job?  

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
15.5.6  charger 383  replied to  Tessylo @15.5.5    4 weeks ago

Playing in the NFL is a very good real job, 

 
 
 
Hallux
PhD Principal
15.5.7  Hallux  replied to  charger 383 @15.5.6    4 weeks ago

If you are cool with the average life playing time of 3.3 years and dealing with every injury catching up with you in later years.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.8  Tessylo  replied to  charger 383 @15.5.6    4 weeks ago

whatever 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.9  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.5.3    4 weeks ago

Probably a lot of date rape in his past

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.5.10  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @15.5.9    4 weeks ago

nah, he probably waited until they were passed out drunk...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.11  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.5.10    4 weeks ago

That actually happened to me one time - I was passed out drunk from a party in my own home - and a friend raped me.  That was the only way he got laid.  I found out years later by asking our mutual friend - he asked the guy and he admitted to having sex with me (raping me) while I was passed out and told my friend that I was really good in bed.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.12  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.5.10    4 weeks ago

I just saw this on facebook regarding the douchebag, and I was correct, he's really, really jealous of Travis and Taylor.

I didn't realize in that 'speech' that he quoted one of Taylor's songs, Bejeweled

"I actually think that Butker quoting Taylor Swift in his dumpster fire of a speech is hilarious when you consider the song he quoted (Bejeweled) is about a successful woman telling a mediocre man to step aside so she can shine"

Taylor Swift for President! 

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
15.5.13  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @15.5.11    4 weeks ago

yikes. some friend ...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.14  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.5.13    4 weeks ago

with friends like that who needs enemas?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.5.15  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @15.5.13    4 weeks ago

Yeah, really.  I had a crush on him before that.  I never really knew what happened until I asked our mutual friend and I remember thinking I had dreamt about having sex with him.  

He did something similar with another mutual friend of ours and she ended up having a relationship with him.  JFC.  Some women are so desperate for a man, any man.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.6  Tessylo  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

I agree - an overpaid jock getting paid millions of dollars - doesn't constitute a real job to me.  Screw this entitled overpaid dick

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
15.6.1  Tessylo  replied to  Tessylo @15.6    4 weeks ago

I've never been a fan of organized sports in the first place though I'm a fan of Orioles fans, my hometown baseball team.

I'm not against football players in general.  I know/I'm sure there are a ton of decent ones out there that do give freely to worthy causes and their communities.  

I'm not against any organized sports players in general either.

I just don't like entitled privileged pricks like this.  

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
15.7  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Gsquared @15    4 weeks ago

What’s a real job according to you?  Do you think that entertainer doesn’t qualify or just sports entertainer?

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
16  Sparty On    4 weeks ago

Harrison Butker.

Seems like a good, son, husband, father, brother and straight white man. [deleted][]

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
16.1  devangelical  replied to  Sparty On @16    4 weeks ago

please prioritize that list by order of importance for everyone...

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
16.1.1  Sparty On  replied to  devangelical @16.1    3 weeks ago

I’ll leave that for the triggered.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
16.2  Sparty On  replied to  Sparty On @16    3 weeks ago

[removed][]

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
17  Gsquared    4 weeks ago

Harrison Butker.

Seems like a misogynist and a homophobe. [deleted][]

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
17.1  Tessylo  replied to  Gsquared @17    4 weeks ago

[removed][]

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
17.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  Gsquared @17    4 weeks ago
Seems like a misogynist and a homophobe. For that, he must be loved by many right wingers.

He earned his success, thinks for himself and doesn't bow to the mob, has a family and doesn't hate humanity.[]

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
17.2.1  Gsquared  replied to  Sean Treacy @17.2    4 weeks ago

Comment 17.2 is a transparent attempt to cover for his misogyny and homophobia.  

 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
17.2.2  bugsy  replied to  Gsquared @17.2.1    4 weeks ago

Knowing that some women thrive at being mothers and wives is not misogyny and not SUPPORTING a lifestyle he does not agree with is not homophobia.

Try again.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
17.2.3  Gsquared  replied to  bugsy @17.2.2    4 weeks ago

Ask many of the women there whether they thought his speech was misogynistic.

“To point this out specifically that that’s what we’re looking forward to in life seems like our four years of hard work wasn’t really important,” student Kassidy Neuner said regarding Butker’s statements about women anticipating being a wife and a mother.

Not homophobic?  Perhaps you're not aware of what he said:

the deadly sin sort of pride that has an entire month dedicated to it
 
 
 
bugsy
Professor Participates
17.2.4  bugsy  replied to  Gsquared @17.2.3    4 weeks ago
Ask many of the women there whether they thought his speech was misogynistic.

What degree did she receive? If it is anything like "gender studies" or "social worker", then she will probably be unemployed, with either cats or settle down to have a family. Many women can handle both a career and being a mother. Most leftist women want life handed to them and do not know how to multi task.

"Perhaps you're not aware of what he said:

the deadly sin sort of pride that has an entire month dedicated to it"
Not agreeing to a lifestyle is not phobic. You don't like a conservative lifestyle. As a matter of fact, most leftists absolutely despise it. Does that make you a phobic of conservatism? No. It means you don't agree with it.
 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
17.2.5  Gsquared  replied to  bugsy @17.2.4    4 weeks ago
Most leftist women want life handed to them and do not know how to multi task.

Obviously, you've never met any.  Nice smear of millions of hard-working women, though.  That comment is pure reactionary hate.  I'm sure Butker agrees with you.

Not agreeing to a lifestyle is not phobic.

Thinking it's a "deadly sin" most definitely is.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
18  sandy-2021492    4 weeks ago

Butker's mother works in radiation oncology.  I'm sure her patients are glad she had a career outside of the home.  Seems to me that saving lives is pretty important work, too.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
18.1  Split Personality  replied to  sandy-2021492 @18    4 weeks ago

Harrison has a clothing line with NOVUS, his first entrepreneurial venture to put his early excess income to use.

Then he co founded a clothing manufacturer that specializes in custom men's suits.

His father was a investment adviser so Harrison partnered with his best friend to open a holding company where his father now works.

Excessive amounts of money works wonders in what one can accomplish and believe.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
18.1.1  sandy-2021492  replied to  Split Personality @18.1    4 weeks ago

Honestly, I don't care how he comes by his money, so long as he's not harming or defrauding people.  I would say that some careers are more important than others.  In my book, health professionals will always be more important than professional athletes.

I do care that he sweeps away the career ambitions of women when he was raised by a highly-educated, successful professional woman.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
18.1.2  Split Personality  replied to  sandy-2021492 @18.1.1    4 weeks ago
In my book, health professionals will always be more important than professional athletes.

Hear! Hear! Well said.

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
18.1.3  charger 383  replied to  sandy-2021492 @18.1.1    4 weeks ago

Good Dentists and Doctors help more people than Kickers or Quarterbacks.

 And I think Pro athletes should stick to playing their games and making goofy commercials, I like them better when they keep their politics and religion to themselves. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
18.1.4  sandy-2021492  replied to  charger 383 @18.1.3    4 weeks ago

Thank you.

I don't even mind them making speeches.  But I think it's best to tailor those speeches to their audience and the occasion.  Graduation shouldn't be political, and it's about celebrating the accomplishments of graduates, instead of downplaying them.  Butkers downplayed those accomplishments.  He sort of said, "It's great that you got your MRS degree, girls.  Now it's time to start birthin' some babies.  My wife loves birthin' babies.  You should, too."

 
 
 
MonsterMash
Sophomore Quiet
18.1.5  MonsterMash  replied to  sandy-2021492 @18.1.1    4 weeks ago

"I do care that he sweeps away the career ambitions of women when he was raised by a highly-educated, successful professional woman."

A woman whom also is good at being a wife, mother, and homemaker.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
18.1.6  sandy-2021492  replied to  MonsterMash @18.1.5    4 weeks ago

A man can also be a good husband, father, and homemaker.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
18.1.7  Trout Giggles  replied to  sandy-2021492 @18.1.6    3 weeks ago

Yeah! How come nobody ever mentions men in that way?

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
18.1.8  devangelical  replied to  sandy-2021492 @18.1.6    3 weeks ago
homemaker

that job doesn't pay enough...

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
19  Split Personality    4 weeks ago

Along with bring back Latin and Purgatory et.al. to "fix" the USA

SMH

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
19.1  sandy-2021492  replied to  Split Personality @19    4 weeks ago

His fixation on the Traditional Latin Mass was a bit confusing for me, TBH.  Maybe it's because I'm not Catholic.  But is a mass said in a dead language somehow holier than one said in a language understood by the congregation?  What's the point of giving a sermon in which only a few words will be understood by most of the audience?

To me, it always seemed that holding proceedings in Latin was a way the priesthood kept the power of the Church, which in times past influenced not just religious but secular life, to themselves.  If lay men and women don't know what's being said, how can they judge for themselves whether it's consistent with what the Church claims is its message and mission?

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
19.1.1  Thomas  replied to  sandy-2021492 @19.1    4 weeks ago
To me, it always seemed that holding proceedings in Latin was a way the priesthood kept the power of the Church, which in times past influenced not just religious but secular life, to themselves.

Having it's own words and language is part of being a Profession, definitionally. There are words in any profession that sets the professional apart from the everyday person. One of the benefits of all priests knowing Latin was that any priest, anywhere, could talk to another priest. 

I once knew a Southern Baptist Minister who learned Latin because he wanted to read the versions that came before to compare, contrast and learn more about the Bible. I enjoyed my conversations with him even though he was a true believer and I was a godless libertarian because we both respected the other as a person.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
19.1.2  sandy-2021492  replied to  Thomas @19.1.1    4 weeks ago

I can see that advantage.

But the Church actually made it illegal to have a Bible printed in any language other than Latin.  William Tyndale died for translating it.  Henry VIII finally made it legal in England, in defiance of Rome.

So I think it's likely a bit of both.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
19.1.3  Split Personality  replied to  sandy-2021492 @19.1    4 weeks ago
If lay men and women don't know what's being said, how can they judge for themselves whether it's consistent with what the Church claims is its message and mission?

I once challenged a priest because his sermon wasn't what the reading from the Bible was and the adult woman who gave the reading was greatly upset with the priest.  He was pissed that we understood Latin; His excuse was that he wasn't prepared so he just went with a standard sermon he loved and adlibbed.

Between all of the fees, (donations) for Masses, Baptisms, First Communions, Weddings and Funerals I quickly realized that this was simply a business.

As I got older and realized how much real estate and art work the Catholic Church owns while it churns every parish daily for money for upkeep I wondered if they ever spent anything on the poor or remembered Christ's mission.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
19.1.4  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @19.1.3    4 weeks ago
Between all of the fees, (donations) for Masses, Baptisms, First Communions, Weddings and Funerals I quickly realized that this was simply a business.

a tax exempt business...

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
19.1.5  sandy-2021492  replied to  Split Personality @19.1.3    4 weeks ago
As I got older and realized how much real estate and art work the Catholic Church owns while it churns every parish daily for money for upkeep I wondered if they ever spent anything on the poor or remembered Christ's mission.

Yeah, for an organization that makes its priests and nuns take a vow of poverty, it seems to be awfully rich.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
19.1.6  Split Personality  replied to  sandy-2021492 @19.1.5    4 weeks ago

believe me there are plenty of workarounds. My grandfather always garaged one of his nicer cars at whatever convent my Aunt was assigned to.

Likewise one of her sisters always made a week or two available to the whole convent to stay at the beach.

Many nuns had a lot of "borrowed" possessions.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
19.1.7  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  devangelical @19.1.4    4 weeks ago
a tax exempt business...

Like universities…

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
19.1.8  Split Personality  replied to  Split Personality @19.1.6    4 weeks ago

I remember when a new pastor came to the convent and had a cow because a few of the ladies had

laptops that they used for teaching, grading, making reports etc for the grade school.

The laptops technically belonged to other family members etc.

The priest was having none of it and confiscated all of their extras reminding them of their vows of poverty.

A day or two later the pastor was in a tizzy because "his" Chrysler was missing.

The Mother Superior reminded him of his vow of poverty and told him to take the bus to meet the Bishop,

unless he could apologize to the nuns and have dinner with my grandfather,

who would gladly return the Chrysler in exchange for a good old fashioned Mass in his house.

Most of the nun's belongings were returned post haste except for the beer and makeup, lol.

CMTSU

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
19.1.9  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @19.1.8    4 weeks ago

not surprising. I've mentioned a few scandals I got caught up in the denver archdiocese here a couple times. I'm fairly confident that if there is a heaven, 99% of male catholic clergy didn't/won't make the cut. I even had some priest at a church refuge for troubled male clergy square off with me when I told the facility manager that some damaged stucco would need to be repaired after we were done with the project because of water damage.

I was referred directly to them by the archdiocese as their preferred contractor and after that episode I never submitted a bid. I later heard one of their parishioner/contractors totally fucked that place up. too bad...                my secret to being a successful contractor was knowing which projects not to take.

 
 
 
Thomas
Senior Guide
19.1.10  Thomas  replied to  sandy-2021492 @19.1.5    3 weeks ago
Yeah, for an organization that makes its priests and nuns take a vow of poverty, it seems to be awfully rich.

That's the organization, not it's members

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Expert
19.1.11  sandy-2021492  replied to  Thomas @19.1.10    3 weeks ago

Agreed.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
20  Tacos!    4 weeks ago

I watched the whole thing and I didn’t think it warranted the dramatic responses I’ve seen. That is not to say I agree with him on everything. I think his obsession with holding mass in Latin is misguided, but to each his own. Additionally, he took an unnecessary, childish, and obnoxious shot at LGBT+ people.

But most of what he said to women seemed ok. I think his remarks at that section of his speech are being distorted. He didn’t say women shouldn’t have a career. He also didn’t say a woman was incomplete if she didn’t have children and stay at home to raise them. He said that he and his wife found their greatest joy in family and the home.

There’s honestly nothing wrong with that. There have been plenty of people who were successful in business but regret their lack of children or their poor record in domestic relationships.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
20.1  Tessylo  replied to  Tacos! @20    4 weeks ago

Seemed ok?  I agree to disagree.  IMHO.   Telling these women they've been lied to and preaching to them about IVF and ignorance about LGBTQ+ folks and talking against President Biden - none of that had any place there.

But as you say, to each their own

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
20.1.1  Tacos!  replied to  Tessylo @20.1    4 weeks ago

I wonder how much work he did on the speech. It seems carefully crafted to largely avoid directly telling people how to live their lives. So I extended to him the benefit of the doubt, even though I suspect his true heart is less tolerant. In my experience, the Catholic Church is not so “live and let live.” And the suggestion that people actually move so they can hear mass in Latin is a hint to me that he is actually an extremist conservative even for a Catholic. His jab at Pride indicates he might be an asshole.

But those are personal impressions. I’m not going to attack him for something he didn’t explicitly say.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
20.1.2  Sparty On  replied to  Tacos! @20.1.1    3 weeks ago
In my experience, the Catholic Church is not so “live and let live.”

Like in most things, some are and some aren’t.    Catholics being live and let live that is.    Related to the church, I grew up catholic and don’t recall women being discouraged from a career other than housewife.    Of course I’m a guy so simply might not have noticed it.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
20.2  Split Personality  replied to  Tacos! @20    4 weeks ago

I think his most current contract was for 3.6 million.  That's absolutely not what's going to happen to the vast majority of the

graduates.  When my first wife and I went to the priest for marriage counseling he made it quite clear to her that abortion

and birth control were grounds for excommunication...

Years later, my second wife took my first son to the rectory and they checked their computers and essentially threw her out,

told her my son was a bastard destined to hell because I had gotten a divorce and remarried "illegally".

Five years later, my parents were visiting the Naval hospital where my youngest was born and we were all at the NICU

looking at all of the babies and I was retelling that story when another visitor in civies interrupted and expressed his horror and disbelief at overhearing this.

This stranger was the Chief Chaplain of the United States and arranged to baptize all the children at once.

He had no misgivings about my feelings about the Church, he did it to assuage my parent's and grandparent's fears 

about the kiddos going to hell.  It was an act of kindness.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Guide
20.2.1  Tacos!  replied to  Split Personality @20.2    4 weeks ago

Yeah I’m not generally a fan of the Catholic Church, although I do see signs of progress in recent years. 

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
20.2.2  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @20.2    4 weeks ago

my 90 year old mother is still troubled that I'm the only one in the family that wasn't baptized. she's even apologized to me about it during covid. I laughed it off and told her "too late", as in I would never let that take place now.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
20.2.3  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @20.2    3 weeks ago
told her my son was a bastard destined to hell because I had gotten a divorce and remarried "illegally".

religious forgiveness in action...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
20.2.4  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @20.2.3    3 weeks ago

I remember my best friend growing up, Michael, who I didn't realize suffered from depression, you would have never known, told his pastor that he was gay and his pastor told him that he was going to burn in hell.

Years later, not due to this, he committed suicide.  Stepped in front of a subway train after an appointment, he had been getting treatment at Johns Hopkins for depression.  

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
20.2.5  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @20.2.4    3 weeks ago

I was in a head on collision about 20 years ago and suffered a closed head injury. besides memory loss and a few other symptoms, I was having insomnia and lost my appetite. a doctor prescribed an antidepressant, which made me feel loaded all the time, and I hated the side effects. I finally told my doc I stopped taking them and he became alarmed and said there was a higher risk of suicide, have I had any suicidal thoughts, do I own any guns, etc, etc. I laughed and told him I could never do that to my kids, and it would be way too much trouble. he asked me why it would be too much trouble and I told him that I'd be settling a few scores and making sure quite a few others would be passing thru the exit before I did. it was about a 10 year span of appts before I saw him again and I got to deal with his assistants that actually had a sense of humor.

 
 
 
Sparty On
Professor Principal
20.3  Sparty On  replied to  Tacos! @20    3 weeks ago
But most of what he said to women seemed ok.

Agreed.

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
21  GregTx    4 weeks ago

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
21.1  Tessylo  replied to  GregTx @21    4 weeks ago

Is that supposed to mean something?

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
21.1.1  GregTx  replied to  Tessylo @21.1    4 weeks ago

[]

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
21.2  Tessylo  replied to  GregTx @21    4 weeks ago

Is that supposed to mean something?

 
 
 
GregTx
Professor Guide
21.2.1  GregTx  replied to  Tessylo @21.2    4 weeks ago

[deleted][]

 
 
 
MonsterMash
Sophomore Quiet
22  MonsterMash    3 weeks ago

What surprised me is that people were outraged that a traditional Catholic speaking to a Catholic audience believes things that Catholics have proclaimed for thousands of years.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
22.1  devangelical  replied to  MonsterMash @22    3 weeks ago
things that Catholics have proclaimed for thousands of years.

has it been that long?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
22.1.1  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @22.1    3 weeks ago

lol

 
 

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