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Elon Musk Cosigns Racist Claim That Black Students Have Low IQs

  

Category:  News & Politics

By:  kavika  •  2 months ago  •  150 comments

Elon Musk Cosigns Racist Claim That Black Students Have Low IQs

Another month, another endorsement of a deeply racist conspiracy theory by multi-hyphenate billionaire Elon Musk.

Late last year, Musk threw a   massive tantrum   on stage following outrage at his calling an unhinged and antisemitic conspiracy theory " the actual truth ."

Now, Musk has similarly endorsed a tweet suggesting Black students at Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) have lower IQs and shouldn't become pilots.


"It will take an airplane crashing and killing hundreds of people for them to change this crazy policy of  DIE," he   tweeted , in response to a   post   arguing that IQ averages were lower at HBCUs, and lower than the "average IQ of US Air Force pilots."

DIE was a likely intentionally rearranged acronym of DEI, which stands for "diversity, equity, and inclusion" initiatives.

The original post went as far as to imply that students at HBCUs had IQs that put them near "the threshold for what is considered 'borderline intellectual impairment.'"

Musk was referring to a United Airlines program that allows students at three HBCUs to interview to become a pilot, which was established in 2021.






"Do you want to fly in an airplane where they prioritized DEI hiring over your safety?" he tweeted in a   separate post , despite the existence of   extremely strict requirements   for applicants.


LINK TO SEEDED ARTICLE: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/elon-musk-cosigns-racist-claim-that-black-students-have-low-iqs/ar-AA1mOLVQ?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=5687f964a836488e809e78d7527ad6ba&ei=44


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Kavika
Professor Principal
1  author  Kavika     2 months ago

OK, Elon, time for beddy-bye and no more ''coke'' for you.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Senior Expert
1.1  Gsquared  replied to  Kavika @1    2 months ago

Heil Musk!

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
1.1.1  author  Kavika   replied to  Gsquared @1.1    2 months ago
Heil Musk!

The new leader of the pack.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.1.2  Split Personality  replied to  Kavika @1.1.1    2 months ago

Funny guy that funny named twat from South Africa.

After waiting for years and putting up with the same ole, same ole racist BS from the US Army Air Corp

The 332nd finally began accompanying bombers in WWII

In a very short time, these black American fighter pilots were in high demand because of their skills in killing German pilots and measurably protecting our bombers better than the all white units that had preceded them.

Tuskegee Airmen: The African-American Military Pilots of WW2 - History (historyonthenet.com)

10 African American Pioneers of Aviation and Aerospace - A Better Day - What's happening at the Dayton International Airport (flydayton.com)

Low IQ?

The U.S. Army Air Corps had established the   Psychological Research Unit 1   at   Maxwell Army Air Field ,   Montgomery, Alabama , and other units around the country for aviation cadet training, which included the identification, selection, education, and training of pilots,   navigators   and   bombardiers . Psychologists employed in these research studies and training programs used some of the first   standardized tests   to quantify   IQ , dexterity, and leadership qualities to select and train the best-suited personnel for the roles of bombardier, navigator, and pilot. The Air Corps determined that the existing programs would be used for all units, including all-black units. At Tuskegee, this effort continued with the selection and training of the Tuskegee Airmen. The War Department set up a system to accept only those with a level of flight experience or higher education which ensured that only the ablest and most intelligent African-American applicants were able to join. [ citation needed ]

Airman   Coleman Young , later the first   African-American   mayor of Detroit , told journalist   Studs Terkel   about the process:

They made the standards so high, we actually became an elite group. We were screened and super-screened. We were unquestionably the brightest and most physically fit young blacks in the country. We were super-better because of the irrational laws of Jim Crow. You can't bring that many intelligent young people together and train 'em as fighting men and expect them to supinely roll over when you try to fuck over 'em, right? (Laughs.) [12]

Tuskegee Airmen - Wikipedia

Elon's just another run of the mill billionaire racist

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.3  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.2    2 months ago

honorary son of the confederacy...

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.1.4  Split Personality  replied to  devangelical @1.1.3    2 months ago

Exactly.  He was raised in an atmosphere of "paradise lost" because of the two Boar wars lost to the British then the final insult of losing Apartheid to the majority black population.

Very analogous to our own Civil War and todays attitudes south of the Mason Dixon.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
1.1.5  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.4    2 months ago
todays attitudes south of the Mason Dixon.

Amazingly, there is a Black reverse migration underway.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.1.6  Split Personality  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @1.1.5    2 months ago

why, nobody likes snow, lol.

Even I moved to TX, :)

Although it is entertaining watching coyotes hunting in the snow

I would prefer watching it on PBS 

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.1.7  devangelical  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.6    2 months ago

for the last several years, I've drifted closer to the equator in the fall...

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
1.1.8  Krishna  replied to  Split Personality @1.1.2    one month ago
Funny guy that funny named twat from South Africa.

South African Blacks had experienced really horrendous atrocities under Apartheid. Fortunately that's over-- but much of the culture there is incredibly fucked up in other ways:

The rate of  sexual violence in South Africa  is among the highest recorded in the world.

More women are attacked than men, and children have also been targeted, partly owing to a myth that having sex with a virgin  will cure a man of  HIV/AIDS .

Rape victims are at high risk of contracting HIV/AIDS owing to the high prevalence of the disease in South Africa. " Corrective rape " is also perpetrated against  LGBT  men and women.

Sexual violence amongst the highest in the world. And I've read elsewhere that South Africe is actually #1 for the highest percapita incidence of child rape in the world! jrSmiley_5_smiley_image.png

Which IMO is indicative of some of the prevailing values there-- so my guess is that may have been a major influence on Musk's values.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.2  Tessylo  replied to  Kavika @1    2 months ago

Musk is intellectually impaired.

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
1.2.1  Split Personality  replied to  Tessylo @1.2    2 months ago

more like a sadistic savant maybe?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.2.2  Tessylo  replied to  Split Personality @1.2.1    2 months ago

That's the truth because I believe he has Asperger's and I do believe he is a genius, but you got it SP, sadistic savant sounds about right.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
1.2.3  devangelical  replied to  Tessylo @1.2.2    2 months ago

he probably tortured all his childhood pets...

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
2  Drinker of the Wry    2 months ago

Not sure why Musk thinks that piloting requires a high IQ.  Seems to me to be more a mechanical task and a willingness to follow a pre-flight checklist exactly.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
2.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2    2 months ago
more a mechanical task and a willingness to follow a pre-flight checklist exactly.

Not ever having flown a plane, I would imagine it requires the ability to process alot of variables in a timely fashion. Maybe that's not so much true as flight becomes more automated, but still seems like alot of real time information to process when things start getting a little wonky. 

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Junior Guide
2.2  Right Down the Center  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2    2 months ago
Not sure why Musk thinks that piloting requires a high IQ. 

Agree.  I wonder if IQ is actually part of the requirements at all.  If not it makes the whole discussion of IQ moot.  When I get on a plane I want the pilot to be the best qualified to fly a plane, not the guy with the highest IQ.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
3  Sean Treacy    2 months ago

tweet suggesting Black students at Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) have lower IQs 

Do they? 

Seems to be the correct response would be to prove the tweet wrong rather than scream racist. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
3.1  CB  replied to  Sean Treacy @3    2 months ago

How dare you! Elon Musk should probably check with his CEO friends of color to see how big of a lump he just asked them to swallow after he spitted it in their faces! And you. . . How dare you! I've see some really ignorant White "ROCKS" (as in he is a 'rock' who can't think his way out of a box but is smart enough to show up everyday for work) on jobs everyday and they have great jobs owing to their ability to just sit 'tight' and show up for the span of a twenty year career. . .you know: feed the babies they're having with the "lucky" mom.

How dare you ask people of color to go the extra distance to prove anything to such people at that!

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2  author  Kavika   replied to  Sean Treacy @3    2 months ago
Seems to be the correct response would be to prove the tweet wrong rather than scream racist. 

The correct response would be to read the article which answers that question. 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
3.2.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Kavika @3.2    2 months ago
onse would be to read the article which answers that question. 

So yes, the typical  student at these schools do have significantly lower IQs  than the average pilot. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.2  author  Kavika   replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.1    2 months ago
So yes, the typical  student at these schools do have significantly lower IQs  than the average pilot. 

It seems from your response that your reading ability is impaired or lacking this evening or your just being yourself, defending the indefensible.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
3.2.3  Sean Treacy  replied to  Kavika @3.2.2    2 months ago

Another substance free response from you.  Typical. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.4  author  Kavika   replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.3    2 months ago
Another substance free response from you.  Typical. 

Happy that a person of your intellect appreciated it.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
3.2.5  devangelical  replied to  Kavika @3.2.4    2 months ago

have you noticed that collared mackerel snappers have to travel in pairs now?

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Junior Guide
4  Right Down the Center    2 months ago

So who would you rather have flying your plane other than the best qualified pilot?

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
4.1  author  Kavika   replied to  Right Down the Center @4    2 months ago
 So who would you rather have flying your plane other than the best qualified pilot?

Who said it wouldn't be...Oh that's right Elon if they people of color.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
4.1.1  Sean Treacy  replied to  Kavika @4.1    2 months ago
Who said it wouldn't be.

Right. This will be the only DEI program  that takes only the best qualified applicants. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
4.1.2  author  Kavika   replied to  Sean Treacy @4.1.1    2 months ago

Did you fail to get into a DEI program being a wannabe? It really seems to upset you, which is great, love to see mindless rants.

It's United Airlines with the program and I'm sure that they would put unqualified employees in charge of billions of dollars worth of equipment and hundreds of thousands of lives. 

Do you really have any idea of what your taking about.? 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
4.1.3  Sean Treacy  replied to  Kavika @4.1.2    2 months ago
l to get into a DEI program being a wannabe? It really seems to upset you, which is great, love to see mindless rants.

Again, making it personal because you can't construct an argument.  Sad.  I've tried to help you out down below with an actual argument because you are floundering but maybe you need more help to try and keep up? Or are you happy just flinging poo and  calling names? 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
4.1.4  author  Kavika   replied to  Sean Treacy @4.1.3    2 months ago

No need to construct an argument since watching you rant is worth billions.

 
 
 
Right Down the Center
Junior Guide
4.1.5  Right Down the Center  replied to  Kavika @4.1    2 months ago
Who said it wouldn't be...

Good to know.  So tell me how DEI makes sure the best qualified person is accepted into the program.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
4.1.6  author  Kavika   replied to  Right Down the Center @4.1.5    2 months ago

Whether your the best or not if you cannot excel in the program, (which has very strict standards) you're washed out. 

Not that difficult to figure out.

If it is so worrisome for you perhaps it's best if you don't fly on United.

 
 
 
Igknorantzruls
Freshman Silent
4.1.7  Igknorantzruls  replied to  Kavika @4.1.6    2 months ago

Seems he has distaste for United, and like those he prefers to emulate, by his own written words, i'd have to assume he prefers Divided. Much easier to conquer I've heard, and the herd is preferred divided, for just such occasions. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
5  JohnRussell    2 months ago

Donald Trump Jr, a jagoffs jagoff, went down these lines on his podcast a day or two ago. He vented about how diversity would make flying unsafe or not as safe as it could be, implying that people of color are not intelligent enough to fly airplanes. 

Then he went further and said that he also wanted the best doctors , and implied that whites were the best in the medical field as well. 

I had heart valve replacement (tavr) this past August, and my regular cardiologist , an Asian, recommended I go see his colleague, another Asian doctor.  I did, and he was funny, reassuring, and extremely confident.  He probably should be because he lectures on tavr heart valve replacement in front of medical groups. Before the procedure nurses at the hospital asked me who was doing the operation and when I told them his name they just said "he is the best". 

Don Jr. and Musk are fools, and have an audience of fools. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
5.1  author  Kavika   replied to  JohnRussell @5    2 months ago
Don Jr. and Musk are fools, and have an audience of fools. 

And their all aboard a ''ship of fools''.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
5.2  CB  replied to  JohnRussell @5    2 months ago

We know Don Jr. is a fool, because he apparently can not get his mentally challenged Dad to stop spending money on high-priced lawyers and the family businesses and trust funds are about to take further and painfully deep hits. One can be forgiven for asking why the fool is not checking Dad instead of talking about people of color who are getting ahead-in spite of people like him trying to keep them down!

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  JohnRussell @5    one month ago

Huh! I think airlines should worry about how well their aircraft are constructed

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
5.3.1  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.3    one month ago

what? you don't like the idea of flying 400mph in an elongated aluminum can built by the lowest bidders?

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
5.3.2  devangelical  replied to  devangelical @5.3.1    one month ago

... at around 30K feet in altitude?

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5.3.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  devangelical @5.3.1    one month ago

Not really. I've taken a liking to my sking

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6  JohnRussell    2 months ago

This is the post on X that Musk responded to

The average IQ of USAF pilots is about 120, and the figures I've seen for major airline pilots range from 115 to 130. By contrast, the mean IQ of grads from two of those United Airline HBCU "partners" is about 85 to 90, based on the average SATs at those schools. (The SAT correlates reasonably well with IQ.) To put this into context, the HBCU IQ averages are within 10 points of the threshold for what is considered "borderline intellectual impairment," while the pilots IQ averages are within 10 points of what is considered "intellectually gifted." I'll add that IQ is a well-studied and well-known predictor of job performance, especially for quick-processing and mentally-demanding occupations like major airline pilot. https:// twitter.com/ali_wetrill/st atus/1744793966703497698

If that isnt racism nothing is. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
6.1  JohnRussell  replied to  JohnRussell @6    2 months ago
  there’s a  mountain of evidence  that demonstrates that the SAT mirrors and even encourages racial disparities in the United States. That’s been true since the test’s inception. Both the SAT and the IQ test were developed in part by eugenicists who were concerned that “racial mixture” would lead to the decline of the US, according to the  National Education Association .

“On average, scores of underrepresented groups are lower than scores of Whites and Asians for a host of societal reasons,” Akil Bello, Senior Director of Advocacy and Advancement at FairTest. Among a variety of factors, the cost of SAT prep classes and of taking the test multiple times means that money and socio-economic status play a major role in test scores. Some colleges and universities have even moved away from mandatory SAT test scores in the admission process in recent years, in part because of the race issues baked into the test. Any conversation about race and the SAT that ignores these well-known problems is nonsense, Bello said.

Elon Musk Seems to Endorse Tweet Saying Students at HBCUs Have Low IQs (gizmodo.com)
 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
6.2  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  JohnRussell @6    2 months ago

Yeah, that is pretty bad. 

This is an interesting read though:

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
7  CB    2 months ago

I am going to closely read/check out the bigoted responses that cross the 'wire' on this  article. Elon Musk's disrespect WILL cost him in a myriad of ways. Arrogance personified. It is not enough that he is a really smart man, he had to go and exhibit what an authentic 'fool' he is and its not the weed problem. It's him, all him, doing weed a 'disservice.'

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8  Sean Treacy    2 months ago

Here's the tweeter's response:

Here are a few of the ridiculous claims in the article: — “The majority of students at these schools [Delaware State and Elizabeth City State] have scores that are at or just below the national average” LMAO. Only 17 schools in the entire country have a lower mean SAT than Delaware State's (910 combined), and Elizabeth City State student performance on the SAT (965) ranks among the 80 worst in the country. (There are about 3,000 4-year institutions in the US.) https:// collegesimply.com/colleges/rank/ colleges/lowest-sat-scores/

“These [SAT] scores are nowhere near an indication of 'borderline intellectual impairment'” A 910 SAT score (on the current test version) is the equivalent of an IQ below 90 (and remember a lot of the school's students score below 910) , which is, in fact, as I stated in my tweet, well within 10 points of the threshold of “borderline intellectual impairment,” clinically defined as one that might occur at an IQ between 71 and 85.

“A huge body of research shows that IQ isn’t a good measure of cognitive ability.” No such “large body of research” exists. The percentage of scientists conducting research into human intelligence who believe IQ isn't a good measure of general intelligence is almost certainly in the single-digits. IQ's core effects replicate with ease. Its predictive validity is unmatched in psychology. Thread with sources here: https:// twitter.com/PaoloShirasi/s tatus/1546868267830108160

— “Socio-economic status plays a major role in test scores” Sure, but it doesn't explain the race gaps. The highest decile of black earners in the US (the most privileged blacks) do not outscore the lowest decile of white earners (the least privileged whites) on the SAT, and at every decile there's a (usually significant) gap between whites and blacks. SES does not explain race gaps on the SAT, and equalizing income doesn't close them.

— “The College Board, which writes and administers the SAT, says that the test is not designed to measure intelligence” This is correct! The SAT is not designed to measure intelligence. In fact, the College Board has gone out of its way over the last several decades to try to make the test less and less a test of intelligence IN AN EFFORT TO CLOSE THE EMBARRASSINGLY PERSISTENT RACIAL GAPS ON THE TEST. But what The Root doesn't mention is that even though the g-loading of the test has been deliberately reduced over time, THE SAT STILL CORRELATES WITH IQ (at about 0.70), and the reason that it still correlates with IQ is because if you remove too much of the test's g-loading (its ability to measure general intelligence) the test will no longer be able to do what it is supposed to do, which is: Measure the potential for college success. IQ predicts academic success.

— “The SAT mirrors racial inequality.” Well of course it does because that inequality is substantially driven by differences in each group's distribution of general intelligence, which the SAT — despite being reworked over and over again to make it less g-loaded in order to reduce the race score gaps — still measures reasonably well. All the SAT results are doing is showing us, once again, that outcomes, especially educational ones, are influenced by general intelligence. It's no accident that in most of the important group outcomes in the US (such as income and educational attainment), we see this rank-order: 1. Asians (106 mean IQ) 2. Whites (100 mean IQ) 3. Blacks (85 mean IQ) The scientific literature contains hundreds of studies finding that IQ is associated with important life outcomes, sometimes even more strongly than any other variable.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8    2 months ago

All of that is racism. You should be ashamed to post it here. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.1  CB  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1    2 months ago

Such people are wickedness personified. They will say any negative shit they can to demean other people as an explanation for why they are SUPER-SIZED JERKS who go way back. Nothing stupid and cruel about people of color whom have squarely faced the worse forms of hatred and its repeat repercussions is beyond jerks ability to vocalize. This is why they don't want society to change: They can't change. 

It is their pitifully, sad, and disgusting minds that are the bane of this country, but. . .we're stuck with them. . . and they propagate like 'rabbits' too!

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.1.2  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1    2 months ago
All of that is racism.

Those are arguments that can be proven/disproven. Try it. 

The flaw in the argument, which none of the racism screamers mere have managed to pick up on, is that he's using the average student at these schools IQ (which is low)  and not the IQ's of any students who may actually enter the program.

The arguments are either right or wrong.  Simply claiming  racism (a term that no longer has much meaning) doesn't address whether the claims are true or not.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
8.1.3  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.2    2 months ago

Well, Sean, then all pilots should be Asian since they blow everyone else out of the water.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.1.4  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @8.1.3    2 months ago
en all pilots should be Asian since they blow everyone else out of the wate

No, because all asians are  not the same, nor are people of any other race. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.5  CB  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.2    2 months ago

Well Sean, if race has no meaning then you should be up and arms that Elon Musk is "X-ing" about it. But, you are not up in arms about what Elon Musk "X'ed." I am clear as to why you are not. 

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
8.1.6  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.4    2 months ago

Wait, but then all blacks are not the same either, right?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.1.7  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @8.1.6    2 months ago
then all blacks are not the same either, right?

Of course not. Who claimed they were? 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.8  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.7    2 months ago

You have posted opinion on this seed which purports to reinforce the claim that blacks are not intelligent enough to fly airplanes.  If that was not your intention, then why did you post those comments ? 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.9  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.2    2 months ago
he's using the average student at these schools IQ (which is low) 

USING IT FOR WHAT ? 

The "tweeter" connects black students at these colleges to a lack of the "necessities" to fly airplanes. 

the HBCU IQ averages are within 10 points of the threshold for what is considered "borderline intellectual impairment," while the pilots IQ averages are within 10 points of what is considered "intellectually gifted." 

If he, or you , dont intend to use averages to disqualify black candidates to be pilots, what the fuck is the point of his argument? 

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.10  Drakkonis  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.2    2 months ago
The arguments are either right or wrong.  Simply claiming  racism (a term that no longer has much meaning) doesn't address whether the claims are true or not.

Agreed. Those calling you a racist are simply reacting, not actually considering what you are saying, which is easier than dealing with what it would mean if what you are saying is correct. 

Perrie brought out a point that I thought points to where the actual problem lies and it isn't race.

Well, Sean, then all pilots should be Asian since they blow everyone else out of the water. (Perrie 8.1.3 )

One can just go the easy way and think the explanation is racial but I don't think it is. I think the answer for the differences being talked about here is cultural. Asian children, as I understand it, have a much higher degree of pressure to succeed and make something of themselves than any other racial group that I have seen. Compare that to here where, regardless of racial group, more and more children's primary target in life is self-image, money, reputation, entertainment and other less academically focused endeavors. 

As for me, I don't think you're racist. I think you're just trying to actually discuss the issue, which is taboo to a lot of people here. They much prefer the anonymity of not standing out, apparently. If they were seen actually thinking about what you've said, someone might call them racist, after all. 

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.11  Drakkonis  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1.9    2 months ago
If he, or you , dont intend to use averages to disqualify black candidates to be pilots, what the fuck is the point of his argument? 

It never was about disqualifying black pilots. It was about the stupidity of having a less qualified pilot take the place of a more qualified pilot in order to satisfy a DEI agenda. There's nothing I've seen that said what  Musk or anyone else, not a Musk hater, has said that I found to be overtly racist. Hard to be sure because although the article above has links to other articles that supposedly link to what Musk said, I was never actually able to read what Musk actually said, only what the writer claims Musk was saying. Kind of hard to decide under those circumstances. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.12  JohnRussell  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.11    2 months ago

Musk retweeted a tweet that specifically compares, negatively, the  AVERAGE  IQ's of HBCU students and existing airline pilots. The inference is as plain as day. 

The word average is used in order to disqualify black would be pilots, at least in the tweeters mind, and presumably in Musk's as well. 

You can continue to try and spin this though. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.13  CB  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.11    2 months ago

I am just sitting here wondering how the "F" (cutting all the way through the pretty BS floating on the surface) we are supposed to get experienced pilots of color (PoC) numbers up. . .when they have to deal with the shit of PERSUADING nosy-ass MAGAs they are worthy of the effort being put in to do so. Do try to explain. . . but I bet MAGAs won't even try, because MAKING SENSE and not just being passionate critics of the so-called Left is what MAGAs do.

DEI are just bad in the eyes and minds of narrow-minded people who never wanted this country to be diverse, equitable, and inclusive from its start. Don't hide and throw shit. Come out where ever you all are and own your worldview.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
8.1.14  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @8.1.13    2 months ago

I thought that it is illegal for an employer to discriminate for or against a job applicant because of his or her race, color, religion, sex,  national origin, age , disability or genetic information. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.15  CB  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @8.1.14    2 months ago

Don't worry about it. You have enough to think about already. Let policy-makers and legislatures do their jobs.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
8.1.16  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @8.1.15    2 months ago
Don't worry about it.

What me worry?

You have enough to think about already.

It's not a finite number.

Let policy-makers and legislatures do their jobs.

Why would you imagine that somehow I'm preventing them?

 
 
 
Split Personality
Professor Guide
8.1.17  Split Personality  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.11    2 months ago
It never was about disqualifying black pilots. It was about the stupidity of having a less qualified pilot take the place of a more qualified pilot in order to satisfy a DEI agenda.

prove that that has ever happened.

There are no white pilots in China, fewer in Africa, but the USA has a culture of hiring USAF white, male pilots to the tune of  93% of todays pilots are still white, male, veterans.

Not in Nigeria or Israel.

It's a cultural and racist issue.

It will slowly correct itself as my generation fades away and gives in to the shortages of qualified pilots with the "right stuff" regardless of the color of their skin or their IQs.

The pilots changing the face of aviation | CNN

Home - ORGANIZATION OF BLACK AEROSPACE PROFESSIONALS (obap.org)

United Aviation Academy seeks diversity, to recruit more Blacks, women (usatoday.com)

Don't forget that aviation is basically still in its infancy, it's just not very diverse in the area between Canada and Mexico as far as pilots go.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.18  CB  replied to  Split Personality @8.1.17    2 months ago

It's petty 'Americans' who do all they can to obstruct , block , treat as inferior , and disincentivize blacks and other marginalized people to not aspire to success (while they remove all 'barriers' to their own MAGA successes-just see congress rolling out the 'red carpet' for a dog like Trump: even to the GOP itself ) . Incidentally, if Trump could not control the GOP he would not wish or be a part or play 'second fiddle' to any other of its members. Gullible MAGAs gave him their political 'world' and he is 'bulldogging" it into  the ground.

But here we are with MAGA and its affiliates doing and writing whatever negative partisan thing they can to discount people of color who are getting out from under their 'foot.' It's disgusting. First, MAGAs whine that minorities can't achieve, then they say minorities won't achieve, then they whine about how minorities achieve and the circle completes itself by 'looping.' 

Incidentally, you will never, ever, read MAGAs writing about the black and other minorities who excel as pilots. Who won out by breaking through the distractions and became pilots because they passed every hurdle lain in their path by envious, mischievous, and malicious haters or strivers against minority placemen or equality in this land we love. A case in point:

NASM-9A03353.jpg?h=540a86a9&itok=N6yBtPH_

Patrice Clarke-Washington

In 1994, Clarke-Washington became the first African American woman to serve as a captain for a major U.S. airline. Patrice Clarke-Washington worked as a captain for the United Parcel Service, better known as UPS. UPS is one of the air express carriers specializing in rapid delivery of high-priority packages which rose to prominence after deregulation in the 1970s. One of her uniforms from 1998 resides in the museum's collection

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.19  Drakkonis  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1.12    2 months ago
Musk retweeted a tweet that specifically compares, negatively, the  AVERAGE  IQ's of HBCU students and existing airline pilots. The inference is as plain as day.

How do you know what that tweet was or what it said. I don't. Know why? Because it isn't in the article above. Go to the original article and click on all the links in it and you won't find it in any of those, either. In fact, you won't find links to much of what Musk has said at all. Only the person writing an opinion piece they're trying to pass off as an actual story. In short, nothing that allows one to make their own decisions. Musk has posted racist rhetoric because they say he has. Sorry, but I'm going to need a bit more than that. There's absolutely nothing in the article that can be taken as fact because he doesn't present any actual evidence. 

So, here's my what-should-be-obvious question. Why should this have anything to do with HBCU's, or any other college, at all? If there is a racist reason for the apparently unsatisfactory number of black pilots in airlines, would not logic dictate that the problem just might lie with the airlines? Or, maybe there simply aren't enough black people qualifying to satisfy whatever magic number of black pilots there should be because they don't meet the qualifications? In either case, what does involving colleges, black or not, have to do with fixing that? 

As far as I can tell from what I largely suspect is simply a hit piece on Musk, The impression I get is that Musk, and whatever tweet he was agreeing with, had to do with their perceived perception of what amounts to a pilot being hired more to DEI than qualification. That is not a racist concern, but a valid one, in my opinion. Unfortunately, I can't come to a conclusion one way or the other because there's nothing here. 

As far as your "AVERAGE  IQ's", whether that is racist or not depends on whether or not it's true or false. Simple as that. 

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.20  Drakkonis  replied to  Split Personality @8.1.17    2 months ago
There are no white pilots in China, fewer in Africa, but the USA has a culture of hiring USAF white, male pilots to the tune of  93% of todays pilots are still white, male, veterans. It's a cultural and racist issue.

More likely, as an airline, they would want to hire an already trained pilot of heavies with thousands of hours already under their belt. The military is a natural source for that. Whether it's anyone's fault that most of those pilots are white can be examined, but I'm not going to fault airlines for doing the smartest, cheapest thing they can do to obtain qualified pilots. 

On a side note, I'm not a fan of any airline hiring any college kids as pilots. Let them start as cargo haulers until they have experience built up or go through the military.  

Don't forget that aviation is basically still in its infancy, it's just not very diverse in the area between Canada and Mexico as far as pilots go.

Don't have a problem with that changing. I don't care what the pilot looks like who is flying me and my family members, as long as they were the best qualified when they were hired. Just like I don't care what my doctor looks like and for the same reason. 

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.21  Drakkonis  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1.8    2 months ago
You have posted opinion on this seed which purports to reinforce the claim that blacks are not intelligent enough to fly airplanes.

No, he hasn't. Like the writer of the article above, that is simply how you are characterizing it. 

If that was not your intention, then why did you post those comments ?

My guess would be to include some actual facts in the conversation lacking in the article???

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.22  JohnRussell  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.19    2 months ago
This is the post on X that Musk responded to
The average IQ of USAF pilots is about 120, and the figures I've seen for major airline pilots range from 115 to 130. By contrast, the mean IQ of grads from two of those United Airline HBCU "partners" is about 85 to 90, based on the average SATs at those schools. (The SAT correlates reasonably well with IQ.) To put this into context, the HBCU IQ averages are within 10 points of the threshold for what is considered "borderline intellectual impairment," while the pilots IQ averages are within 10 points of what is considered "intellectually gifted." I'll add that IQ is a well-studied and well-known predictor of job performance, especially for quick-processing and mentally-demanding occupations like major airline pilot. https:// twitter.com/ali_wetrill/st atus/1744793966703497698

If you cant see the implications of those statements then there is no point in continuing to discuss this. 

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.23  Drakkonis  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1.22    2 months ago
If you cant see the implications of those statements then there is no point in continuing to discuss this.

You said "implications", plural. That means more than one, right? Are you aware of any of them other than the one you prefer? I doubt it, since your only contribution to the discussion is that even discussing it is racist. I'm going to tell you what I see. 

Assuming that what is in the quote you provided is true and accurate, it has a problem. While it seems to be true that two of the three colleges United Airlines is partnering with really are at the shallow end of the SAT pool, that in itself doesn't mean there are no capable individuals who could pass the program United offers. It's a Bell curve and there's bound to be some of those. They just attend those colleges because they can't afford to go anywhere else. So, simply stating those statistics doesn't mean there are no individuals who could qualify.

However, those colleges are at the shallow end of the SAT pool and, like it or not, they give the SAT for a reason. The problem with that is, according to United Airlines CEO Scott Kirby...

Over the next decade, United will train 5,000 pilots who will be guaranteed a job with United, after they complete the requirements of the Aviate program – and our plan is for half of them to be women and people of color. We’re excited that JPMorgan Chase has agreed to support our work to diversify our pilot ranks and create new opportunities for thousands of women and people of color who want to pursue a career in aviation.

Fine. But the concern is that if United actually wants to increase the number of non-white pilots, why try and draw from such a shallow pool? Is it more important that they are HBCU's? That's what a lot of people are afraid of. That standards are going to be lowered for those students in order to attain DEI goals. For the last decade we've seen plenty of examples where skin color and/or gender were the primary qualification for a job and then actual performance qualifications second. This is a legitimate concern. 

Of course, it may be that United will not lower its standards and are partnering with these schools simply for the PR angle. It would be an explanation for fishing in such shallow waters.

Or, United is making a sincere effort and has no intention of lowering standards for students from those schools. That's what I hope is true. I'm happy for whomever they manage to find there. I just have my doubts about how many pilots they're going to find. Every student with a higher SAT score, no matter the color, wants to get into the best school they can manage. 

In the end, it's possible the guy you quoted said what he said out of racist motives. Impossible to tell from simply that post. It's also possible he said it because of a concern United is considering DEI more important than qualifications; something not out of the realm of possibility. Again, no way to tell what the guy's motive was. 

But, hey. Keep on trying to shame anyone who doesn't toe your line. It's your thing. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.24  JohnRussell  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.23    2 months ago
In the end, it's possible the guy you quoted said what he said out of racist motives. Impossible to tell from simply that post. It's also possible he said it because of a concern United is considering DEI more important than qualifications; something not out of the realm of possibility. Again, no way to tell what the guy's motive was. 

In ONE PARAGRAPH he compared the IQ of pilots to the IQ of students at black colleges, and said the black IQ's were "borderline intellectual impairment" and you think there is no racial implication ?  What is wrong with you ? 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.25  CB  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.20    2 months ago
I'm not going to fault airlines for doing the smartest, cheapest thing they can do to obtain qualified pilots. 

And yet when they do provide the industry qualified pilots using methods and certifications-you look for an alternative that does not INCLUDE (Inclusive) their policy, and you disapprove. Perhaps, they should just let MAGAs decide who is worthy to be a pilot. 

The irony is there is no pleasing some conservatives that does not involve letting them run 'everything.' Because Lord knows, some conservatives have an opinion about damn near everything regarding "Others" and what they can be or do in this country.

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.26  Drakkonis  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1.24    2 months ago
In ONE PARAGRAPH he compared the IQ of pilots to the IQ of students at black colleges, and said the black IQ's were "borderline intellectual impairment" and you think there is no racial implication ?

Apparently, the paragraph you posted here isn't the one you're talking about now because I can't find anywhere in it where he actually says black IQ's are anything, one way or the other. The paragraph I'm looking at says By contrast, the mean IQ of grads from two of those United Airline HBCU "partners" is about 85 to 90, based on the average SATs at those schools. He's not even talking about students. He's talking about grads. The graduation rate at Delaware State University is only 37% and, since the guy seems to have done some research, is probably aware that not all of those grads are black. If grads by race are reasonably close to enrolment, it means that about 67% are black and the rest white, Hispanic or other races so he couldn't be referring to only black IQ's. 

I wonder if the only reason United even partnered with Delaware is that it was one of the few, maybe one of the only three HBCU's that actually had aviation programs. 

I think the problem here is that as soon as the word "black" appears in this it becomes about race for you. Maybe you ought to actually check your assumptions? 

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.27  Drakkonis  replied to  CB @8.1.25    2 months ago
And yet when they do provide the industry qualified pilots using methods and certifications-you look for an alternative that does not INCLUDE (Inclusive) their policy, you disapprove.

Where did I say I disapprove of what United is doing? I actually approve of what they are doing, as long as the students at these colleges have to meet the same standards as any other, without exception. Well, that isn't entirely accurate. I would prefer that if an airline were going to help any college student, regardless of race, that they help them qualify to be pilots for the military first and a promise of a job afterwords if they are successful. Get some experience there first. There should be a preference for military pilots over college students simply because they served their country. But that's me. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.28  CB  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.23    2 months ago
That's what a lot of people are afraid of.

Cut the BS. What MAGAs are afraid of is fear itself! Always have to FIND something to complaint about! And then MAGAs informs other MAGAs what they should fear and make repeat noises against.

Musk has his problem with exploding test rockets and liftoffs that do not make it to space many times! And yet he "deathwishes" HBCU pilots trained by the industry. Give them the chances he gives himself/Space X. BTW, Musk's projects are partially funded by government grants too!

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.29  CB  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.27    2 months ago
Where did I say I disapprove of what United is doing? I actually approve of what they are doing, as long as the students at these colleges have to meet the same standards as any other, without exception

That is the point, you are not an aviation policy-maker. You have no responsibility to bring Others into the aviation field where more pilots are needed. You don't understand the matrices involved or problem-solving as the leaders in the aviation community, nor do you make EXCEPTIONS for the future of the pilots programs. Additionally, if the industry is short of pilots and in need of a new supply 'source' or 'stock' - it seems to be 'running out' of White men with "SUPERIOR" TEST SCORES. . . . The industry is looking elsewhere because it likely has no other choice but to evolve/involve Others. 

Finally, you don't know what you are complaining about, but insist on NO EXCEPTIONS out of some tradition that hates seeing outsiders and others advance. For that alone, I could hate everything for which you stand!

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.30  JohnRussell  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.26    2 months ago

this is the tweet that Musk responded to, according to the seeded article

i/o on X: "The average IQ of USAF pilots is about 120, and the figures I've seen for major airline pilots range from 115 to 130. By contrast, the mean IQ of grads from two of those United Airline HBCU "partners" is about 85 to 90, based on the average SATs at those schools. (The SAT…" / X (twitter.com)

i copied and pasted it two days ago as a comment on this seed

i am not wrong about this, i am quoting the tweet that is the backbone of this entire controversy

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.1.31  JohnRussell  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.26    2 months ago

you are making excuses for all this, and i have to wonder why

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
8.1.32  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @8.1.29    2 months ago
You are not an aviation policy-maker. You have no responsibility to bring Others into the aviation field where more pilots are needed.


The FAA isn’t responsible either, airlines are.  I don’t know of a causal between high IQ and piloting or a college degree for that matter.  Airline are short pilots then they have to alter recruiting.

Drop the 4 year degree requirement, broaden training facilities, add signing bonuses, increased pay, and boost benefits. This isn’t rocket science.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.33  CB  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @8.1.32    2 months ago

Whatever works. The aviation policy-makers chose DEI. Elon Musk can suck on it.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
8.1.34  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @8.1.33    2 months ago
The aviation policy-makers chose DEI.

For finding FAA employees, not pilots.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.1.35  CB  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @8.1.34    2 months ago

I have not mentioned the FAA. I am talking about airline corporations with diversity programs helping marginalized groups engage and involve themselves in the aviation field. I don't know what or why you are having trouble with this. And I don't plan on trying to figure it out. My statement stands. And you can just go with it or leave it alone.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
8.1.36  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  CB @8.1.35    2 months ago
I have not mentioned the FAA

Oh, so not government policy makers.

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
8.1.37  charger 383  replied to  Drakkonis @8.1.23    2 months ago

8.1.23 was responded to by member addressed so it stays, charger

 
 
 
Drakkonis
Professor Guide
8.1.38  Drakkonis  replied to  JohnRussell @8.1.31    2 months ago
you are making excuses for all this, and i have to wonder why

Excuses. Okay. Well, I can see I'm not making any headway with you and am not likely to. Trying to explain to you why it's a fool's game to make the judgements you do based on fragments of what is obviously a larger conversation held elsewhere has been made and rejected. Won't trouble you further. 

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
8.1.39  Krishna  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.1.7    one month ago
Who claimed they were? 

Elon Musk?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.2  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8    2 months ago
“The SAT mirrors racial inequality.” Well of course it does because that inequality is substantially driven by differences in each group's distribution of general intelligence, which the SAT — despite being reworked over and over again to make it less g-loaded in order to reduce the race score gaps — still measures reasonably well.

stone cold racism. 

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Guide
8.2.1  Greg Jones  replied to  JohnRussell @8.2    2 months ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.2.2  CB  replied to  Greg Jones @8.2.1    2 months ago

And yet, some of MAGA has been displaced by people of color: Rising. Just keep talking shit as we continue struggling against the MINDFUCKS that MAGA brings on a cyclic basis to this nation. That is, MAGA argues the wrong side of damn near 'everything.' It is a stupid form of power-play. And, all it really accomplishes is to slow down progress in this nation and in the surrounding world.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
8.3  author  Kavika   replied to  Sean Treacy @8    2 months ago

It's great to see you defending racism.

 

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Guide
8.3.1  Greg Jones  replied to  Kavika @8.3    2 months ago

What's racist about it? Please explain.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.3.2  JohnRussell  replied to  Greg Jones @8.3.1    2 months ago

You cant apply traits that belong to individuals to a group. If blacks are less intelligent then why arent all of them less intelligent?  I'm sure there are many many black people who are more intelligent than you or I am, and I have a well above average IQ. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
8.3.3  author  Kavika   replied to  Greg Jones @8.3.1    2 months ago
What's racist about it? Please explain.

If your unable to see it in the article, there is nothing I can do to help you out.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.3.4  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @8.3.2    2 months ago
nt apply traits that belong to individuals to a group.

Of course you can. It's not racist to say the average Dane is taller than the average Chinese male. Then again I'm sure some would claim it is.  Nor would that mean a Chinese man can't be taller than a Danish male. It's simply  averages. 

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
8.3.5  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.3.4    2 months ago

So do you endorse Eugenics? 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.3.6  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @8.3.5    2 months ago
o do you endorse Eugenics? 

Lol.  Define what you think eugenics is. If you think anything I wrote can be interpreted as an endorsement of Eugenics, you are  mistaken. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.3.7  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.3.4    2 months ago
It's not racist to say the average Dane is taller than the average Chinese male. 

How do you know? Maybe height is an important criteria for some people. 

To say that blacks shouldnt be airline pilots because they are not intelligent enough is racism. It is stereotyping individuals based on a perceived or imagined group difference. 

The HBCU students were granted interviews with the airline, not guaranteed jobs. One would presume the airline will reject candidates who dont meet their criteria. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.3.8  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.3.4    2 months ago
It's simply  averages. 

And you think we should use averages to determine who should be allowed to fly airplanes.  And if you dont think that is the case, what is the point of posting the things you have on this seed? 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Principal
8.3.9  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @8.3.7    2 months ago
w do you know? Maybe height is an important criteria for some people. 

You think height can be racist because it matters to people?

Nothing can better prove my point that "racism" is now a meaningless concept. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
8.3.10  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.3.9    2 months ago
You think height can be racist because it matters to people?

Of course it could if it was important to people. 

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
8.3.11  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.3.6    2 months ago

You might want to read this from UVA, to see why I asked you that.

And then think about why does it matter to Musk?

I guess he never heard of the Tuskegee Airmen?

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
8.3.12  CB  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @8.3.11    2 months ago

 " A fighter pilot is a mathematician, an athlete, and a sharpshooter. He has got to know what is going on in his plane. . . the heart of a fighter [plane] is steel and copper. . .it's bloodstream is gas and oil, but its brain is the man who flies it."

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
8.3.13  Tessylo  replied to  JohnRussell @8.3.8    2 months ago

Yeah, it's just averages when determining someone's qualifications/intelligence to be a pilot.jrSmiley_80_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
8.3.14  Krishna  replied to  Sean Treacy @8.3.4    one month ago
Of course you can. It's not racist to say the average Dane is taller than the average Chinese male. Then again I'm sure some would claim it is.  Nor would that mean a Chinese man can't be taller than a Danish male. It's simply  averages. 

Actually there's another aspect to this.

Obviously height is easy to measure. But actually intelligence is a little trickier.

For starters, there are different types of intelligence. 

And many people confuse "intelligence" with other traits, such as "common sense". (A highly intelligent person may lack common sense--and vice-versa).

A person may be high in "Verbal intelligence"_- but low in "Emotional Intelligence".

Then there's the trait of "analytic skills"-- which is different than "Intuition">

And what about the world's greatest artists (certainly brilliant in an artistic sense) but who may or may not be intelligent in other areas.)

And so on.

 

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
8.4  Krishna  replied to  Sean Treacy @8    2 months ago
IQ predicts academic success.

In my experience, motivation is a better indicator of academic success than IQ.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
9  CB    2 months ago

The First Black And Youngest Overall Pilot To Fly Solo Around The World Solo Has Established An Aviation Training School To Bring More Diversity To Industry

Aria Bell
December 26, 2023 · 46854ea967ab8ff467d71456c8f6b4a8
The First Black And Youngest Overall Pilot To Fly Solo Around The World Solo Has Established An Aviation Training School To Bring More Diversity To Industry | Photo: EXTREME-PHOTOGRAPHER via Getty Images

Captain Barrington Irving is happy that the training institution he founded is helping other   minorities   find long-standing careers in   aviation .

It’s no secret that there is a lack of diversity in aviation when it comes to   pilots , and   research   conducted in 2022 found that less than two percent of commercial airline pilots are Black, according to   NBC News .

Although Irving not only broke a glass ceiling when he became the youngest person and first Black pilot to journey around the world solo, he is now encouraging more people of color to consider aviation as a career through education, according to   News 7 Miami .

Irving founded the   Barrington Irving Technical Training School  to guide and teach the next generation interested in becoming pilots the fundamental tools needed to be successful in the industry.

Feeling like a happy parent, Captain Irving recently celebrated 15 new graduates who completed his training program with a ceremony at Opa-locka Airport in Miami. This is a full-circle moment for the educator because he began his career at the same airport as a struggling student. His student rosters have been filled with people from diverse cultures who already had an interest in aviation, faced hardships, or didn’t have any background in it, which makes him take pride in the work he’s doing to assist in changing their lives.

“I am so proud of them, and to know what they started from,” Irving told the news station. “Opa-locka Airport is where I got my start.”

 


A repeat reminder that like everything else people of color have to defend about themselves, here is another Jerk who crashes rocket 'ships' at will while looking for his ticket to the big leagues and then when he got there he 'parked' a damn car in space. Nobody said a word! We applauded it. Stupid as it is (as if anybody could drive it with no roads to make contact with it). 

People of Color have been dealing with bigmouthed bigots Non-stop for way too long. These jerks just never let up! They always have their damn mouths open seeking toxins out of them into the stream of consciousness!

The good news. Blacks and Others have taken 'everything' these dogs have thrown out and down in their nasty and vicious and we are 'rising' and we will be and continue to be successful and take first/top spots right along beside "them." 

Let the struggle continue, because bigots are jealous - then and now!

 
 
 
shona1
PhD Quiet
10  shona1    2 months ago

Arvo..I called Elon Musk a maggot years ago after his disgusting comments re one of the rescue divers in Thailand of the soccer team stuck in the caves..

I still stand by my comment and even more so with the morons comments over the last 12 months..

I rest my case..

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
10.1  author  Kavika   replied to  shona1 @10    2 months ago
Arvo..I called Elon Musk a maggot years ago after his disgusting comments re one of the rescue divers in Thailand of the soccer team stuck in the caves..

I remember that incident, he was scum then and he is racist/scum now but there are those that will defend him no matter what he has to say. 

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
11  CB    2 months ago
" I t will take an airplane crashing and killing hundreds of people for them to change this crazy policy of  DIE," [MUSK] tweeted  , in response to a    post    arguing that IQ averages were lower at HBCUs, and lower than the "average IQ of US Air Force pilots."

Where was these Jerks complains about a past history of numerous plane crashes that 'built' aviation into the industry (and community of fliers and "the flown") we know and trust (like a 'Trailways bus' in the skies of the world) today ? Those pilots learning their skills (and crashing and burning with passengers along with crews) did not get this line of argument from the usual suspects of which it is clear Elon Musk has exposed himself to be one (of them).

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
12  CB    2 months ago

Elon's moment of reality (upcoming): ?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia.tenor.com%2Fimages%2F3cae8ead8ee4a13a67b97b7276ec458d%2Ftenor.gif&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=69ddad72c1b90ed521c1988861bb53e81555df25ed705f925e85eab8b52b616d&ipo=images

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Professor Principal
13  Just Jim NC TttH    2 months ago

Digest this.........................

Just  3.4%  of U.S. airline pilots are Black, 2.2% are of Asian descent, and a paltry 0.5% are Hispanic or Latino. Women make up just 4.6%. As the U.S. population trends to greater racial and ethnic diversity, airline pilots look less like their passengers.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14  Jeremy Retired in NC    2 months ago

Not quite sure why the left is so up in arms about this.  They and the Democrats have been making this claim for years.  That's why things like Affirmative Action and it's updated racist nonsense DEI have been and are in existence.  

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
14.1  CB  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14    2 months ago

You never know anything positive about liberals and independents that I can discern. That's not new. No need to waste time discussing it.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14.1.1  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  CB @14.1    2 months ago
You never know anything positive about liberals and independents that I can discern.

I've seen nothing positive about them.  [deleted]

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
14.1.2  CB  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14.1.1    2 months ago
No need to waste time discussing it.

Easy enough to understand. 

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14.1.3  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  CB @14.1.2    2 months ago

So you can't do it either.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
14.1.4  CB  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14.1.3    2 months ago

Wow. Still writing. Less open engagement with others , I see. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
14.2  JohnRussell  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14    2 months ago

Ridiculous comment. Racial prejudice accounts for those programs, not intelligence differences. 

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14.2.1  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  JohnRussell @14.2    2 months ago
Racial prejudice accounts for those programs, not intelligence differences. 

So you are saying you are in agreeance with Musk?  That's what it looks like to me.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
14.2.2  author  Kavika   replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14.2.1    2 months ago
So you are saying you are in agreeance with Musk?  That's what it looks like to me.

So, Jeremy since you seem to think you have some expertise on race and racism I wondering where that expertise comes from, perhaps being white gives this ability to understand the history both past and present of race and racism and minorities' feelings and experiences. Is that the reason or is it that you don't understand a thing about being a minority but have to hold yourself up and tell us what we feel and experience? Like the ''Great White Father'' syndrome?

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14.2.3  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Kavika @14.2.2    2 months ago

There is A LOT of speculation in your statement. None of it answers my question.

Are you are in agreeance with Musk?  It's a pretty straight forward question.  

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
14.2.4  CB  replied to  Kavika @14.2.2    2 months ago

MAGA wants us all to be "friends" as long as we join their hierarchy. . .at the bottom. And wait to be told when we can move up (slow-crawl). BTW, you will have to come to your own conclusions about MAGAs, because they don't do reasonable discussion. It's all tilted to their worldview and they like to think they control the discussions.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
14.2.5  author  Kavika   replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14.2.3    2 months ago
There is A LOT of speculation in your statement. None of it answers my question.

Not really, simply a question as to why you seem to think that your view is that of an expert on race/racism and the experiences of minorities. Your response to that was a spectacular failure so I guess that we're led to believe that. ''you don't understand a thing about being a minority but have to hold yourself up and tell us what we feel and experience? Like the ''Great White Father'' syndrome?''

Thank you for that admission of ''know nothingness''.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14.2.6  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Kavika @14.2.5    2 months ago
Not really, simply a question as to why you seem to think that your view is that of an expert on race/racism and the experiences of minorities.

Just calling out the obvious hypocrisy.  You seem to take issue with it.  Wonder why.

Just curious about why you are deflecting from my question.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
14.2.7  author  Kavika   replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14.2.6    2 months ago
Just calling out the obvious hypocrisy.  You seem to take issue with it.  Wonder why.

What is obvious hypocrisy to you is called reality to most people. No need to wonder because it only exists in your mind.

Just curious about why you are deflecting from my question.

You shouldn't be curious about it since the answer is there you just choose to ignore it.

My comment isn't there for you to like or dislike. It is there to learn from and if it offends you even better. Because you'll be less likely to repeat your inability to reason and learn about something that you know nothing about.

 
 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
Professor Expert
14.2.8  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Kavika @14.2.7    2 months ago
You shouldn't be curious about it since the answer is there you just choose to ignore it.

It's a simple yes or no question.  It's not complicated.  If you agree with Musk the answer is "yes".  If you disagree with Musk, then the answer is "no".  Nothing required anything close to what you tried to gaslight me with.  

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
14.2.9  author  Kavika   replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @14.2.8    2 months ago

I wasn't gaslighting you simply explaining to you that you have no knowledge or experience in being a minority which gives you a much different view of racist/racism. Your lack of understanding isn't my problem.

FYI, I think that Musk is a racist asshole, and has been for some time. This isn't the first time nor will it be the last, it was just a few weeks ago that he went off on another tangent/rant, about Jews if I remember correctly.

Also consider his company, Telsa and the racism problem they are facing. 

Musk's ventures also happen to have a well-documented problem with overt racism in the workplace, with swastikas and nooses found at Tesla, according to a    lawsuit filed    by the US Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) last year.
"Musk’s company not only refused to investigate complaints or take any steps to end the abuse, it viciously retaliated against employees who complained or opposed the abuse," Morial told    NBC  .   arstechnica
 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
14.2.10  Krishna  replied to  JohnRussell @14.2    2 months ago
Ridiculous comment. Racial prejudice accounts for those programs, not intelligence differences. 

Could be. I really don't know.

However if there is an under-representation of Blacks amongst pilots, it may or may not be due to discrimination. There are other possibilities.

For example, its possible a lower percentage of Blacks my want to become pilots. Its probably not a profession that's talked about much-- or admired a lot-- in the Black community who may prefer other occupations? 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
14.2.11  Vic Eldred  replied to  Krishna @14.2.10    2 months ago
For example, its possible a lower percentage of Blacks my want to become pilots. Its probably not a profession that's talked about much-- or admired a lot-- in the Black community who may prefer other occupations? 

I say culture has the most influence on people. If you look at the NBA you can clearly see that Black players not only dominate the sport but have brought it to a level of excellence. I am sure that Black Americans could master any endeavor that they are encouraged via culture to value.

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
14.2.12  devangelical  replied to  Vic Eldred @14.2.11    one month ago

nice backhanded racial stereotype...

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
14.2.13  Krishna  replied to  Vic Eldred @14.2.11    one month ago

For example, its possible a lower percentage of Blacks my want to become pilots. Its probably not a profession that's talked about much-- or admired a lot-- in the Black community who may prefer other occupations? 

I say culture has the most influence on people. If you look at the NBA you can clearly see that Black players not only dominate the sport but have brought it to a level of excellence. I am sure that Black Americans could master any endeavor that they are encouraged via culture to value.

Here's a story that appeared a while back which I found to be fairly humorous. A somewhat "extremist" Jewish group picketed Madison Square Garden claiming discrimination against Jews in basketball. They demanded that the NY Knicks have the same percentage of Jews on their team as the percentage of Jews in the general population. ("Affirmative Action").

Needless to say they were not successful in heir efforts. 

LOL!

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
14.2.14  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Krishna @14.2.13    one month ago

I wonder how many BB coaches are Jewish?

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
14.2.15  devangelical  replied to  Vic Eldred @14.2.11    one month ago

*

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
15  JohnRussell    2 months ago

interesting

start at 2:30   - the topic ends at about 13:20

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
16  CB    2 months ago
 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
17  CB    2 months ago

THERESA M. CLAIBORNE (1959- )

POSTED ON DECEMBER 8, 2022 BY   CONTRIBUTED BY:   SONYA MORRIS
Captain-Theresa-Claiborne-as-a-United-Airlines-Pilot-Alpha-Magazine.jpg
Captain Theresa Claiborne as a United Airlines Pilot (Alpha Magazine)

Captain Theresa Mae Claiborne was the first African American woman to become a U.S. Air Force pilot. Capt. Claiborne referenced the historic   Tuskegee Airmen   for paving her way to becoming the first Black woman pilot in the Air Force.

Theresa Mae Claiborne was born May 25, 1959 to Wayne Morris Sr. and Dorothy Claiborne in Emporia, Virginia. The Claiborne’s family military background afforded the family the opportunity to travel to many locations. Theresa graduated with honors from Elk Grove Senior High School in Elk Grove, California. She then attended California State University, Sacramento where she majored in Communication, Culture, and Media and graduated from the institution in 1981. Claiborne completed the University of California-Berkeley Air Force Reserve Officer Training Corp (ROTC) program and was commissioned as a United States Air Force second lieutenant on June 20, 1981.

After completing her Pilot Training at Laughlin Air Force Base in Texas, now Lt. Claiborne graduated as the first African American female pilot in the United States Air Force on September 16, 1982. During Claiborne’s active-duty years, she rose in rank to Captain and served as a KC 135 pilot at Loring Air Force Base, Maine.

Captain Claiborne finished active-duty service in September 1988 but continued with the United States Air Force Reserves as a flight commander and an instructor pilot, before becoming a Lieutenant Colonel in November 2001.

Captain-Theresa-Claiborne-as-an-Air-Force-Pilot-Alpa-Magazine-300x285.jpg Captain Theresa Claiborne as an Air Force Pilot (Alpha Magazine)

On January 15, 1990 Lt. Colonel Claiborne joined United Airlines initially as a flight engineer but eventually worked her way up to Captain on a Boeing 757/767 jetliner. Although Claiborne was not the first black woman pilot at United, she remained one of a small number of black female pilots. As late as 2019 she was one of only 15 black women pilots at the airline. Having accumulated a total of over 15,000 civilian flying hours, Lt. Colonel Claiborne became Captain Claiborne at United.

On January 6, 2003, while still flying for United, Lieutenant Colonel Claiborne retired from the U.S. Air Force Reserves. Twelve years later in 2015 she became a member of Sisters of the Skies, founded that year by Lt. Christine Angel Hughes to “pave the way for a new generation of Black female pilots” by providing encouragement and support to younger aspiring African American women interested in pursuing a career as a pilot in the U.S. military or in commercial aviation. Claiborne and other members of Sisters of the Skies provided mentoring, recruitment training, scholarships opportunities, and professional development training.

Captain Theresa Mae Claiborne currently resides in Sacramento, California.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
18  CB    2 months ago

NOTE : This is beautiful. Triumphant. Who in their right mind would criticize diversity, equity, and inclusion on account of this? Check out the woman who breaks into joyous tears over achieving (avion) success!

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
19  CB    2 months ago
 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
20  CB    2 months ago

Aviation Science Management student passed the FAA Private Pilot check Ride

Sophomore TSU Aviation Science Management student Ms. Lubianka Lanka passed her FAA Private Pilot check ride on Sunday May 30th. When you see her on campus please extend your congratulations!!

Ms. Lanka is now a certificated private pilot and the first woman from the TSU flight program to complete this accomplishment.

Image.jpeghttps://coset.tsu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/Image-225x300.jpeg 225w" sizes="(max-width: 400px) 100vw, 400px" >

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
21  CB    2 months ago

Tennessee State University

Aviation Flight Training Program

Bachelor of Science (B.S.)

Departmental Requirements
Bachelor of Science in Aeronautical and Industrial Technology

Aviation Flight Training Core: 57 Semester hours

Major Core:   A minimum of 57 semester hours including: ENGR 4500, 4510, 4900; AITT 1001, 2350, 2500, 2531, 2532, 2533, 3070, 3120, 3480, 3520, 3550, 3560, 3570, 3508, 3600, 3700, 3810, 3900, 3950, 4400.
Core requirements reflect the standards of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), Aviation Accreditation Board International (AABI), Association of Technology, Management and Applied Engineering (ATMAE) and the University Aviation Association (UAA).

Four Year Plan: Bachelor of Science Degree in   Aviation Flight Training   4 year degree program map   or   graduation clearance checklist

Note that one can take the first two years of this concentration at   Columbia State Community College   at community college tuition rates with our new   2+2 program .

FRESHMAN YEAR
Fall Semester Courses HR   Spring Semester Courses HR
ENGR 1000  Engineering Orientation 1   MATH 1720  Precalculus Mathematics II 3
MATH 1710  Precalculus Mathematics I  3   ENGL 1020  Freshman English II 3
ENGL 1010  Freshman English I  3   CHEM 1110  General Chemistry I   3
AITT 1001  Introduction to AIT 3   CHEM 1111  General Chemistry I Laboratory 1
HUMANITIES/FINE ARTS ELECTIVE 3   HUMANITIES/FINE ARTS ELECTIVE 3
HPSS/ROTC/BAND 1   HPSS/ROTC/BAND 1
  14     14
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
SOPHOMORE YEAR
Fall Semester Courses HR   Spring Semester Courses HR
AITT 2350  General Aviation Operations  3   COMM 2200  Public Speaking  3
AITT 2500  Flight Fundamentals 3   AITT 2532  Private Pilot Flight II 1
PHYS 2010  College Physics I    3   AITT 2533  Private Pilot Flight III 1
PHYS 2011  College Physics I Laboratory    1   PHYS 2020  College Physics II 3
ENGL 2110  American Literature  3   PHYS 2021  College Physics II Laboratory  1
HIST 2010  American History I 3   HIST 2020  American History II  3
AITT 2531  Private Pilot Flight I  1   AITT 3520  Instrument Ground Instructor 3
  17   ECON 2010  Principles of Economics  3
        18

 

JUNIOR YEAR    
Fall Semester Courses HR   Spring Semester Courses HR
AITT 3070  Aviation Management 3   MGMT 3010  Management & Organization 3
AITT 3120  Human Factors in Aviation 3   AITT 3581  Commercial Flight Lab 3
AITT 3550  Commercial Ground Instruction  3   AITT 3700  Aviation Meteorology 3
SOCIAL/BEHAVIORAL SCIENCE ELECTIVE 3   AITT 3950  Aviation Safety 3
AITT 3571  Instrument Flight Lab 3   AITT 3480  Statistical Quality Control 3
  15     15
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

SENIOR YEAR  
Fall Semester Courses HR   *Spring Semester Courses HR
AITT 3560  Flight Instructor Ground 3   ENGR 4510  Capstone Design Project II 1
ENGR 4500  Capstone Design Project I     1   MGMT 4050  Organization Behavior 3
ENGR 4900  Professional Development              Seminar    1   AITT 3900  Aviation Legislation 3
AITT 3601  2   AITT 4400  Introduction to Air Traffic Control 3
AITT 3810  Aircraft Systems Analysis 3   300 - 400 TECH OR NON TECH ELECTIVE 4
ENGL 3105  Technical Report Writing 3     14
  13      

    Total Credit Hours 120

TSU is approved by FAA to conduct pilot ground school courses under FAR Part 141.

 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
22  CB    2 months ago

Who can pick fault with this? MAGAs!!!

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
23  author  Kavika     2 months ago

The racist comments endorsed by Musk are not surprising he has a history of it. His ''ventures'' have a bit of a history of racism and management's unwillingness to address it.

Musk's ventures also happen to have a well-documented problem with overt racism in the workplace, with swastikas and nooses found at Tesla, according to a   lawsuit filed   by the US Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) last year.
"Musk’s company not only refused to investigate complaints or take any steps to end the abuse, it viciously retaliated against employees who complained or opposed the abuse," Morial told   NBC .
 
 
 
CB
Professor Principal
24  CB    2 months ago

Now I wonder what the 'back-lash' will be for these racist statements against black youths striving to do better. I remember full well that Musk's car plants heavily employ minorities. That alone requires he tone and check his attitude-way down.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
25  Vic Eldred    one month ago

How do we feel about those who try and virtue signal and defend racism at the same time?

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
25.1  devangelical  replied to  Vic Eldred @25    one month ago

flag them, and politely encourage management to ignore the flags they throw down...

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Junior Expert
25.1.1  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  devangelical @25.1    one month ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
25.1.2  devangelical  replied to  devangelical @25.1    one month ago

yeah, like that...

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
26  author  Kavika     one month ago

Musk is at it again:

SpaceX is trying to take down the NLRB after a group of employees wrote an open letter denouncing Elon Musk's embarrassing behavior

Perhaps the government should stop funding SpaceX or any of Musk's ventures.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
26.1  JohnRussell  replied to  Kavika @26    one month ago

Musk has a god complex. 

 
 
 
devangelical
Professor Principal
26.1.1  devangelical  replied to  JohnRussell @26.1    one month ago

stick a 12 foot cross in the ground and I'll go get a nail gun...

 
 

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